Rolling Marvel Cinematic Universe thread (+ a poll: Classic or Dud?)

considering marvel gave him the keys to the comics, it's a small miracle that the world was never subjected to a kevin smith marvel movie and, given the stakes and his reputation, I think we've likely dodged that bullet forever

if you'd like a good example of some non-highbrow filmmakers whose work would've likely flourished in a world where the primary options aren't billion dollars or straight to video, I'd point straight to Benson and Moorhead.

some interesting Irishman scuttlebutt from Deadline:
https://deadline.com/2019/11/terminator-dark-fate-linda-hamilton-harriet-motherless-brooklyn-weekend-box-office-1202774477/

The unfortunate fact of the matter is that there are some films which won’t work at the box office, given their economics. Studio development execs continually huddle to debate what’s marquee enough. No one in town was going to make a 3 1/2 hour, slow-moving gangster movie with three near 80-year-old actors at a $160M-$200M budget.

Plus, what box office could be made from such an endeavor? Irishman would have likely tanked, and to bring it back to rival distributors, the pic’s release would have boxed some holdovers (maybe as many as two titles a venue) out of the theater. Meantime, despite Motherless Brooklyn not finding an audience, the pic was priced at a reasonable cost in regards to what its B.O. prospects would be.

Netflix in its $5B-plus grossing quarterly revenue, was able to make Irishman, while rival studios didn’t want to gamble. Again, we live in a world where producers have to be agnostic when it comes to the medium their films are made for.

the remaining 95% is increasingly
Streaming.

I feel extremely strongly that streaming music is just basically napster plus tips, i.e. barely better than just stealing music, but I think streaming film and TV content is somehow far fairer to the creators. Maybe because funding movies and shows means paying the rates up front?

Kevin Smith would have obviously made a terrible Marvel movie, is why - it seems pretty clear that "is an enormous comics fan" really wasn't an attribute that Marvel was looking for in its directors?

I thought I read it on this thread but I can't find it - the workhorse doing the most to move Netflix over to the next, respectable, phase of its plan is one Martin J Scorsese, who's going to get it some Oscars.

xp it's easy to say that now but i honestly think if fox had given the 03 daredevil movie to smith to write/direct (and he had just recently come off a "marvel saving" run on the book: http://sequart.org/magazine/52690/kevin-smith-joe-quesada-daredevil/), it ABSOLUTELY would've done better financially and critically than what actually got made. from there, maybe marvel looks at smith for some help on making the iron man movie, possibly brings him in to help craft the long term plans. he coulda been a contender!

anyways, shame on me for forgetting that kevin smith is actually currently writing an animated Howard the Duck series for hulu, so nevermind
https://www.thewrap.com/howard-the-duck-animated-series-marvel-hulu-netflix/

Was gonna say. It's...disheartening.

It's a really nice opinion piece, not least of all because he is humble and honest. He is very honest that he is old, and that he has old ideas about cinema. And... I just think his ideas about cinema are askew (way too much focus on character and narrative, BORING!) and his ideas about distribution and economics are spot on, but aren't helped by his ideas about cinema. And it's worth disconnecting the two.

So, in conclusion, fuck Disney.

Anecdotally, I have to say that the broader cinematic wasteland for which Disney et al are being blamed these days (not without justification) feels very like the cinematic wasteland that small town USA has been for decades. From the time that I first felt sparks of interest in something more than big dumb blockbusters, I was forced to dig and scrape like a motherfucker in order to discover anything that skewed from the mainstream (although I at least had a guide inasmuch as I was lucky enough to come of age at a time when Film Threat was inexplicably available on podunk grocery store magazine racks). If I hadn't made a great deal of use of that Morbs-approved resource of choice, the public library, I would have been at least well into college before I ever saw anything independently-distributed. Hell, even in college we had to drive for an hour and a half to the one theater which was screening that obscure art film Being John Malkovich. I get that there's been an unsavory shift in the market, and particularly to the extent that Disney is being an evil megadick wrt the Fox acquisition, but I honestly wonder how much that shift is even registered outside of metropolitan areas. If anything, it's a helluva lot easier these days to see non-mainstream fare even if you don't have many theatrical options available to you.

"And... I just think his ideas about cinema are askew (way too much focus on character and narrative, BORING!)"

lol as if you could come up with anything better

xp I was super into “indie film” in hs/college (early ‘90s), but I was seeing almost all of it on home video. I didn’t need to resort to the library like Old Lunch; the cool little video stores around (pre-Blockbuster hegemony) had all that stuff. It was a big deal when I was interning near NYC in ‘95, and could, like, take the train to see Amateur at the Angelika.

Maybe that’s why I can’t lament the “home viewing is the only option for most ppl outside NYC/L.A.” angle — I came up watching movies on much crappier screens than exist today.

"And... I just think his ideas about cinema are askew (way too much focus on character and narrative, BORING!)"

lol as if you could come up with anything better

― xyzzzz__, 5. november 2019 15:02 (thirty-eight minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

Fp'ed you for that, and I know the theory is to just fp and otherwise ignore these kinds of unprovoked personal attacks, and just assume that you're having a bad day, and has to sort through some issues, that you just want to take out on somebody else, but seriously. Go fuck yourself, and stop trying to make other people feel as bad as you do. It's so shitty behaviour.

sometimes when we touch
the honesty's too much

Can't decide whether Martin Scorsese or Fred has better ideas about cinema

No wait I can tbh

Fred I thought you blocked me so you couldn't see my posts?

Yeah, then decided you were getting better. But you're apparently still a trolling piece of shit, so back on you go.

I was hoping to just snipe at your shit with no consequences. Now that I've been flagged I don't know how I'll sleep tonight.

Also, why the fuck would you write that crap directly aimed at me, if you didn't thought I would be able to read it? What the fuck is wrong with you?

Like, seriously, are you sick or something?

Tell me why
Everything turned around
Packing up
Shacking up is all you want to do

get a fucking room you two, this is the thread for alternately despairing about the dismal state of current cinema and ruminating on hailee steinfeld's casting as kate bishop

And cornbread
Delicious cornbread

When it comes to assessing ILXors I feel like sickness is maybe the logical starting point

A Chicago metal quartet, Disturbed has been driving fans in the Midwest wild with their frenetic, theatrical live show. On their debut album, The Sickness, the band combines an over-the-top metal groove appealing to the underground with radio-friendly melodic hooks that grab hold of mainstream rock fans.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIcm7WzjC2k

Also Epstein didn't kill himself

well, yeah

I really liked that piece. Just seeing Fred talk about ideas and being all patronising -- especially given what given what he posts on here -- was just too much for me.

And Epstein didn't kill himself

Horshack, on the other hand

take it to the watchmen thread buddy

Took me a second but A+

Unlike Epstein, cinema killed itself

has the coroner weighed in on cinema's hyoid bone yet

Otherwise known as Happy Madison productions

Marty should get in on this action; save Goodfellas for eternity: https://variety.com/2019/film/news/project-silica-superman-warner-bros-microsoft-1203390459/

I thought I read it on this thread but I can't find it - the workhorse doing the most to move Netflix over to the next, respectable, phase of its plan is one Martin J Scorsese, who's going to get it some Oscars.

In the wake of Paramount's dark fate with the Terminator movie, both Sony and Warner Bros. have now suffered "franchise" flops. WB's doing ok, though, in part b/c the Joker movie (which Scorcese considered directing!) was a huge smash.

The article on WB is also interesting, b/c it talks about how how "mid-level" films just aren't making it these days:

“It has to be so frustrating as a studio,” said Jeff Bock, a box office analyst with Exhibitor Relations. “If you look at these misfires, they’re all unique films. ‘Motherless Brooklyn’ would have been a big hit in the 1990s, but that genre is being phased out.”

...“When we think about the best adult dramas these days, we think of streaming and TV shows,” Bock said. “There’s so much genre specific [material on TV] that it’s really hard for these dramas in theaters to compete with that in terms of poignancy.”

Meanwhile, it sounds like the forthcoming Black Widow movie may have things going for it that even Scorsese will appreciate...

But instead of helping propel ticket sales to new records, everything from Sundance darling “Blinded by the Light,” to the gritty action flicks “The Kitchen” and “Shaft” sputtered in spectacular fashion. Moviegoers all but ignored these films, even when the reviews, as in the case of “Blinded by the Light,” were sterling. It’s led to a wildly unpredictable year for Warner Bros.

I can't believe that a Bruce Springsteen musical wasn't an enormous hit in 2019!

Tbf He did sell out 236 nights on Broadway in the preceding months.

Major diff between a romcom set in Luton that merely features the music of Springsteen vs actually seeing the man perform live

xp Billie Joel did something similar at MSG, but I don't think the gritty coming of age musical Piano Man is getting greenlit soon.

(the former is actually really good but it didn't get a lot of fanfare when it came out)

Its not really a musical tbf, it’s Brit feelgood mulch of a kind that has historically been quite successful

Also it’s bad

Xxpost He already has a Broadway jukebox musical, Movin' Out.

It's pretty dumb

Also tbf Springsteen had his *own* Warner Bros. theatrical release that massively flopped. Could be Bruce fatigue, could be "Blinded" came out after "Yesterday" ...