Joe Biden, Senator from Citibank (oops, DELAWARE), to Run for President

Yep. I can't imagine it going any other way tbh.

Actually think Biden will win as the bodies pile up over spring and summer.

the good news is since I'm basically resigned to this outcome if the uh 25% of elderly Biden voters who are enthusiastic about him put together a solid ground game in Michigan then hey, I will get the faintly pleasant surprise of Trump being defeated, but I don't expect it.

and there's always a chance that us posting that only bad outcomes are possible and that Joe Biden is a miserable predatory old fuck motivates someone else to work harder for Joe Biden because of the obvious headwinds he faces!

you never know what posting will accomplish

anyway Jay Inslee will be 73 in 2024, maybe that'll be old enough to capture America's imagination

if we're still having elections then

fifteen years of the digitally unbounded "Joe Biden, Senator from Citibank" thread has yet to curtail his national rise

This is quite true. First he rose from being a senator to being a senator. Then he rose to being the VP on a ticket that no one voted for because he was on the ticket. After which he rose to th exalted position of retired politician for four years.

I'm not worried specifically about any one person posting here having any directly perceptible individual effect on the 2020 election. I'm still going to vote for Bernie, even if he has 'suspended' his campaign by the time my primary is held. But every trend I see suggests Biden is going to walk off with the nomination and be Trump's opponent. I am doing what I can about that, but I assume that won't be enough to stop Biden winning.

What I am suggesting is that within the universe of active, vocal Bernie supporters there is an echo chamber effect and what I am hearing in this thread is a reverberation from that echo chamber, and from everything I can see here, the attitude of "scorning Biden is its own reward" and reflexively dissing him at every turn is becoming the primary Discourse among those vocal active followers, the so-called BernieBros. And they aren't going to drop that habit just because Biden comes out of the convention as the nominee. My perception is they will reinforce one another in an attitude frequently expressed by morbs: a pox on both their houses, or both parties are no different from one another, or voting for Biden would be a betrayal of all I stand for, etc.

And they will congratulate one another on their rectitude and stay away from voting, or vote some third party. And maybe that will be fine, if the race isn't all that close. But recent elections suggest that votes do count and turnout is critical. And fuck it if self-righteousness puts Trump back into office, after all the RESIST bumper stickers have faded to illegibility.

All I'm suggesting is that stepping back from the cheap satisfaction of participating in that echo chamber has merit, because the tune you practice most is the one you'll sing when the show opens.

I think Biden is bad with substantially more conviction and fervor than I think Sanders is good fwiw

I’m not acting here as a Bernie Sanders supporter I’m just pointing out that Joe Biden is bad, yknow? Not fit for the presidency.

yes, but when Sanders becomes irrelevant to who is president in 2021, that conviction and fervor will not get you to a Sanders presidency.

But you’re right that plenty of people will argue that there’s no difference between the two parties (taken in aggregate) and they have some plausible reasons to say so.

why does everybody keep capitalizing Discourse, is it a record label

I’m not a consequentialist Aimless. The moral tightness of things is independent of and prior to their effects. Specifically it’s morally correct to drag Joe Biden for sucking shit.

it's an ironic capitalization

Wow omg “moral tightness” wtf autocorrect

I’m not a consequentialist Aimless.

Then why on earth do you even think about politics?

Uh these are different things

expand, plz

I mean I can be found elsewhere on this borad arguing that a vote isn’t a moral speech act but

I can still prefer or desire certain ends to collective political action without believing that those ends are morally right, or that the preferability or rightness of those ends justifies any given means.

Like the utilitarian argument for voting for the Democrat is generally “fewer people will suffer if you vote for the Democrat” but this has notably failed to ignite the passions of the people in recent memory

a conscious act of omission is as much an act as one of commission. if you have practical desires which are morally neutral, but otherwise beneficial in some respect, then it is practical to choose the action which is best suited to produce your desired ends, or as many as are practicable.

people post about whether the Beatles are good or bad on this borad too

A lot of actions it is functionally impossible to know the effects of, such as posting on a messageboard

Other than, I guess, annoying people

I imagine that if Biden wins in November that the best way for the Democrats to avoid midterm losses in 22 will be to run against Biden.

But you’re right that plenty of people will argue that there’s no difference between the two parties (taken in aggregate) and they have some plausible reasons to say so.

― silby, Sunday, March 29, 2020 5:53 P

You can say this if you're 11 years old or drool. Biden or a stand-in will vote for the judges/justices I want and name hands to regulatory agencies better than any Republican. If this isn't enough, sorry, we can't talk.

I mean if I take my posting hat off I probably agree with you but even for plenty of genuine non-drooling adults “judges and regulators” are somewhat remote arguments, relative to ppl’s urgent need to get out from under the thumb of rent, health insurance, and corporate dissolution of civic live. You can’t say “judges and the EPA!” to counter Joe Biden saying he’d veto medicare for all if it reached his desk. Maybe you can, and I just follow a lot of 20 and 30something communists on twitter. But, yet.

yet guess what -- it fires up GOP voters. And the results are the same. We need justices, judges, and regulators.

Sounds like the choice for progressive pressure groups in the general should be to run ads calling Biden stupid and pliable.

“He’ll do what we say because he is the sucking wound in the chest of our democracy and we’ll stand there and holler at him for you”

even for plenty of genuine non-drooling adults “judges and regulators” are somewhat remote arguments,

this is why Democrats lose

That’s a fantasy though he’ll just funnel free money to Monsanto or whatever idiot thing some K street flack hands him in the morning

Biden needs to campaign on how shitty and miserable he is

That might actually connect with young voters.

this is why Democrats lose

― TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, March 29, 2020 3:54 PM (two minutes ago)

There’s probably lots of reasons.

Are you queer?

Are you of color?

Then this election matters. Sanders lost. If you believe in any kind of leftism, then the movement matters, not the person; the people are expendable. As a queer person of color, I've made my peace with Biden getting the nomination, despite his 40 years of perfidy. Are you? Fucking grow up.

this is why Democrats lose

For far too many "progressives," running/cheering on a grandstanding, mathematically doomed presidential campaign > running for school board or city council.

I can't wait for silby to finally admit that the hundreds of thousands of black people who voted for Biden are stupid.

If by “making my peace” you mean “becoming increasing radicalized, uncompromising, and alienated from the idea of the Democratic Party good not bad” I guess that’s what’s been happening, yes.

I don’t think anyone on earth is stupid except for possibly Joe Biden.

From a UK perspective, this is all depressingly familiar.

Alfred if Biden wins in November I’ll buy you a VHS of your choice and a box of cocktail umbrellas

cheers!

I had no guarantee Sanders or Warren would win in November.

At this point I’ll adhere to my policy against counterfactual speculation

"grow up" will never make me not want to punch a face

we all know Biden > Trump. still fucking sad.

as a queer of potato color, I suggest Dem voters be less fucking stupid no matter their lack of privilege

too late