outbreak! (ebola, sars, coronavirus, etc)

Sanpaku feel free to cite some sources whenever

idk the provenance but this video on how home-made masks have taken off in the Czech Republic is interesting:

https://youtu.be/jZtEX2-n2Hc

A long but incandescent thread:

1. I've never had a hard time sleeping. But the past three nights I have slept a total of 3 hours. I'm writing this so I can sleep.

I am very angry. And I've realized during that having the space to be angry is a privilege because many people are too busy being terrified.

— Yashar Ali 🐘 (@yashar) March 30, 2020

Think Sweden was mentioned upthread and there's an article on their high risk approach here:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/30/catastrophe-sweden-coronavirus-stoicism-lockdown-europe

xp, i don't object to the implication of that thread, but yasher ali is a #resist twitter grifter and that thread sounds like fiction not journalism.

i don't know the guy, but the language does feel like twitter drama and gives me a bad vibe

Huge 20x undercount of deaths in Wuhan? “Based on cremation figures, Wuhan residents estimate more than 40,000 have died, compared with an official toll of 2,535.” #COVID19. The numbers have never added up. Let’s go thru several analyses...
THREAD 🧵: https://t.co/B6OVHnCaiU

— Eric Feigl-Ding (@DrEricDing) March 31, 2020

And more on the counts around the world:

Yet to hear of anywhere that's adjusting, manipulating or recording its mortality data except in a way that minimises it. The real toll is a variable factor worse. https://t.co/8jl8gu2V6n

— Tom (@attentive) March 29, 2020

One wears a mask to be courteous/careful/polite to, and for others.

I don't have a mask, I'm a disgraceful human being.

We (UK) have been doing that too but I think today they are going to release number of fatalities outside of hospitals (but only those tested I presume) xp

Ireland's fatalities have been going up in recent days, and the majority of them seem to be in nursing homes/care facilities :/

https://medium.com/@Cancerwarrior/covid-19-why-we-should-all-wear-masks-there-is-new-scientific-rationale-280e08ceee71

i think it's important to understand the importance of doing things that it's literally impossible for millions and millions of people to do right now. it really really helps.

Pretty much anyone can find a piece of cloth to tie around their mouth and nose.

Maybe Antifa can donate some bandanas

I feel like I work for Big Face Mask since we have been having this same conversation since January. Wear a face covering, people.

Ha, and I think Ed and I and Sanpaku were the same people trying to gently be like "Yeah, wear a face mask."

The thing about china and the cremation figures...that was coming up when the US was talking about blanket do not resuscitate orders. And what China had done instead. it's all bad.

I much prefer your approach to Sanpaku's, but that wouldn't be difficult.

When I was looking up best ways to sew masks (and now there are tons of good patterns on youtube) this was one nice study from 2013 examining using cotton ts, pillow cases, vacuum filters, etc. Just try to use 100% cotton if you have it.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/258525804_Testing_the_Efficacy_of_Homemade_Masks_Would_They_Protect_in_an_Influenza_Pandemic

oh derp. that thing I originally posted with the facemask tutorials had a much nicer link about materials to use. https://smartairfilters.com/en/blog/best-materials-make-diy-face-mask-virus/

in a pinch, I would probably use a cotton t shirt and make sure two layers covered my mouth/nose in public.

none of my handkerchiefs will tie round my face :D

I have a long lizard head, so same here.

your majesty *bows*

When we went to the hospital, the ER doctor told us we definitely don’t need N95 masks unless we’re infected. If you feel it’s necessary, a regular surgical mask or any kind of face covering is fine. I’m def pro people making their own masks instead of buying surgical masks.

The emerging left-wing view in France seems to be that masks should be made universally available, and that the Macron government has failed in not doing so. More masks, fewer cops, is the idea. I don't agree with the latter (no doubt putting me to the right of many on this message board), but the former seems evident. Macron today visited a mask factory near Angers, called for France to move to independence in mask production by the end of the year, and announced the allocation of 4 billion euros for financing the purchase of medicines, ventilators, and masks.

There's no one answer. I think universal mask wearing would slow the spread, but down below epidemic levels? Not by itself. You're still gonna have major outbreak unless you can quickly identify and isolate infected people. Universal masking STILL an extremely worthwhile goal.

https://i.redd.it/dsit8y2kngm41.png

gonna tell my kids this was Belle and Sebastian

Woman 4th from the left hasn't covered her nose, shoot her.

anyone else in the UK not seen any masks for sale and rarely seen anyone wearing them? saw two ppl in Tesco's wearing proper shaped ones. but not really even seen any messaging about them? I wear disposable gloves to shops but masks aren't really on the radar round here, it seems?

I saw quite a few people wearing them today, no idea where they got them though.

I have needles and thread and discardable cotton wearables in the home. Guess this is as good a time as any to learn how to sew properly.

haven't seen that many proper facemasks about here in my suburban bit of UK - more in the town centre, not that I'm heading into town much/at all lately, and most of the people I have seen wearing them have been (east) Asian

queuing for the shops at the weekend a few people had arranged a scarf in front of their face, though someone kept rearranging hers and it seemed to be only covering half her mouth at any given time, so that didn't seem enormously helpful tbh, but still more effort than I was making

(do you need to cover your nose or just your mouth? all the scarf-wearers were only covering their mouth, at best)

I haven't been doing gloves either since I have no disposable gloves and my winter gloves want hand-washed in cold water, whereas I'd want to give them a good hot soapy wash when I'm back

I don't really care about gloves since I wash my hands a lot.

I cover my mouth and nose and wear my glasses or sunglasses out to cover my eyes.

More than half of people have been wearing masks here. I am happy they finally got the cashiers gloves and masks at the large grocery store.

hundreds infected on us navy aircraft carrier

OK, I heard the interview with the CDC yesterday where dude (Redfield?) acknowledged they were reassessing (though not yet recommending) people wear face masks when they go out. Yet it sounded like it was based not on protecting yourself but once again potentially limiting transmission from those who have it. That is, given that so many people seem to be asymptomatic, either full-stop or for a few days before they start exhibiting symptoms, better to cover your nose and mouth to prevent yourself from spraying covid all over before you know any better. But this interview was paired (at least as I encountered it) with an interview with the head of WHO, and both doctors again noted that the virus is by most accounts most efficiently spread through droplets in proximity (via coughing and sneezing, which that Medium piece just above reaffirms) and that significant aerosol transmission from covid literally just hanging around (a la measles) is still not suspected to be the case.

Which brings up the quandary I mentioned: if I am coughing and sneezing and blowing my nose then I am *not* asymptomatic, and if I am *not* coughing and sneezing and blowing my nose, and my mouth is closed, and I am just breathing normally through my nose (as I typically do), then I can't possibly be spreading it all over the place via droplets, and seem at low risk from just catching it from the air the same way (as long as I am not stationed by someone sneezing, coughing or blowing their nose). Now, touching surfaces and unknowingly spreading it that way, sure, that makes sense, especially if I am not washing my hands or I'm touching my face or coughing into my fist or whatever. But a mask won't stop someone from getting it from a doorknob or handle or other surface; they also have to wash their hands all the time for prevention. Indeed, the CDC guy suggested one of the downsides of wearing masks is they give some people a misplaced feeling of invincibility when there often just offering modest, incomplete protection. Which leads me once again to wonder what benefit (to others) there is to wearing a mask unless you are not at all symptomatic.

Now, that Medium piece is right that there is also no *harm* in wearing masks, any more than there is no harm in wearing a hat, and it's at least potentially more helpful than a hat. But given that the built in assumption is that masks (at least in the hands - face? - of civilians) are likely not close to 100% effective (yes, you must cover your nose as well, for example), it still seems to me a better strategy to, mask or no, avoid being around people who are sneezing, coughing, etc. If you can't do that, by all means, people should mask up! But the handful of times I've been out and relatively close to people I have been struck by how quiet it's been. No chatting, no people on phones, and most conspicuously (so far) no sneezing, coughing, etc. And if there was it would not only really stuck out, but I would steer clear, mask or no.

(Caveat being this is strictly an academic argument. By all means, wear a mask if you want. Maybe things will change and you will help rebuild society after dumb people like me are dead.)

just been to the mini-mart by me and they've finally put a perspex guard up across the tills, as i said to the cashier it's taken them long enough for a cheap bit of plastic

dude...

that was for josh.

lol thanks

I totally understand why some people might want masks! And maybe they'll soon recommend everyone wear masks, and I would wear one. But it seems to me just a small part of a bigger safety system, barring new developments, and nowhere near as important as washing hands and distancing.

I am just breathing normally through my nose (as I typically do)

Putting up sneeze guards seems like it could be a good idea. Are they effective with salad bars, or are they just there to make us feel more comfortable?

But it seems to me just a small part of a bigger safety system

yes. you have it right.

life...how does it work?

We all go through life wearing masks.

If you need convincing re: masks, do a quick google for 'washington choir covid'. That's all I needed, really.

Being a small part of a bigger safety system seems like... a good thing to be?

idk maybe being in a room where you're projecting your voice loudly while standing in place, not good