Joe Biden, Senator from Citibank (oops, DELAWARE), to Run for President

man, i fucking HATE that, xyzzzzzz

have i argued with you under a different username on climate denial bullshit comment sections, from the early 2000s present?

I didn't say Biden and Trump were the same however their differences aren't enough to matter.

Karl - are you ok, or do you just hate Television?

Karl has been thoroughly otm

if one does not see Biden making progress on climate change

I feel like "progress" is the sticking point here. While I too would prefer to see actual progress—taking, say, 2015 as a baseline—even "less regress" still constitutes a significant difference, and I'm puzzled as to how the left benefits from pretending otherwise. How does framing Trump's relentless assault on environmental regulations as being equivalent to Biden's platform do anything other than soft-pedal Trump's actions?

alright that kind of got xposted to death, so let me ask: what does matter mean to you guys?

because speaking of not being able to tell the difference between things, i can't distinguish between you and a million WATTS UP WITH THAT blowhards who cite all the very important "skeptical" views on climate change that are absolutely bogus, and then when called out on it by people who know what they're talking about, retort "PROVE IT"

when something is very obvious and everyone agrees on it, the onus is on the guy who can't tell the difference between a petrified hairball and a can of lysol to PROVE IT

Biden would nominate a Neil Gorsuch to the Supreme Court. Biden would nominate Rick Perry and Scott Pruitt to the Cabinet and a major regulatory agency, respectively.

Okay.

xp

It's really that simple. They can be right or wrong or confused or whatever, but if they're a relevant voting bloc it's the candidate's job to earn their votes.

it's also biden's job to win the votes of centrist suburbanites. and the unfortunate structural advantage they have over the left bloc is that their votes are worth twice as much (because they're otherwise going to trump instead of being tossed into a black hole) and they actually aren't gonna be as bummed if trump wins regardless (so they have a more credible threat of not voting for biden.)

Then Biden should relentlessly pursue those centrist suburbanites and abandon the left - and no one should be mad at them when they don't vote for him. If their votes matter less or they're simply worth less as a bloc, then the outcome won't be changed.

he needs to win both it's a balancing act obv

nope, things are either exactly the same, or completely black and white mutually-exclusive options. there is either complete identity or there are polar opposites, nothing between

i'm color-blind to gray scale, i can only see pure black and white

I suffer neither from depression nor any degree of anxiety, thank my DNA. But when I see an intelligent poster in other threads typing twaddle like "their differences aren't enough to matter" that the United States has choked on since Gore-Bush and Clinton-Trump, I realize the posturing about being correct matters more than the evidence in front of their eyes.

Their differences aren't enough to matter

The Trump administration is expected on Thursday to weaken regulations on the release of mercury and other toxic metals from oil and coal-fired power plants, another step toward rolling back health protections in the middle of a pandemic.

The final Environmental Protection Agency rule does not eliminate restrictions on the release of mercury, a heavy metal linked to brain damage. Environmental lawyers said the new method of calculating the costs and benefits of curbing mercury pollution would most likely destroy the legal underpinnings of controls on mercury and many other pollutants.

By reducing the health benefit of regulations on paper, while raising their economic costs, the new method could be used to justify loosening restrictions on any pollutant that the fossil fuel industry has deemed too costly to control.

Their differences aren't enough to matter

“The president of the United States calls the shots,” he said at his evening news briefing. “They can’t do anything without the approval of the president of the United States.”

Asked what provisions of the Constitution gave him the power to override the states if they wanted to remain closed, he said, “Numerous provisions,” without naming any. “When somebody’s the president of the United States, the authority is total.”

Their differences aren't enough to matter

President Donald Trump threatened Wednesday to apply a never-used provision of the US Constitution to allow himself to adjourn the US Congress and push through many of his nominees who typically require Senate confirmation. The move came days after he claimed that he has total authority over the states before backing down.

"As the entire US government works to combat the global pandemic, it is absolutely essential that key positions at relevant federal agencies are fully staffed, and we're not allowing that to take place through our Congress," Trump told reporters in the Rose Garden during his daily coronavirus briefing. "They're just not giving it to us. We have many positions that are unstaffed because we can't get approval."

Joe Biden and Donald Trump's differences aren't enough to matter.

I've never done this in 16 years of ILE membership, but I need at least a 24-hour break from this thread.

Bye, y'all.

^^^ The real goal here, I suspect: Drive away sensible people. This is as pure a demonstration of concrete-skulled trolling as I've seen in years. No demonstration of belief in anything, just pure "that thing you like sucks - CONVINCE ME OTHERWISE but don't bother because nothing matters LOL" nihilism.

tbf, i overreacted to it, even though i've seen it a million times. sorry alfred.

The set of environmental regulations (all the way to the Paris Agreement which the Trump admin has walked away from) aren't going to be sufficient to avert the severe effects of climate change, so this is not a US only problem. A Biden administration putting those back up will not, in the long run, make enough of a difference here when we need to work to stop utilising coal period. This is not posturing. I am not a blowhard, nor am I interested in driving anyone away -- and as others have said I can't vote in the US election anyway -- but I am reading (as someone who posts in this community) how people believe Biden will not bomb Brown people when he served under a president that did that, or there will be a deportation freeze and I'm like are you serious?!

Sorry, Alfred. I hope you're ok and I mean no one any harm.

to death, so let me ask: what does matter mean to you guys?

If I lived in a swing state, 99% chance I'd pull the lever for the Biden. I don't.

What 'matter' means to me is a political vision that means a better world instead of a shittier world marginally slower. Joe Biden probably can't offer that political vision because he has a 50 year career of actively making the world a worse place.

Platforms don't matter when we have your actual record - from the Iraq War to busing from Anita Hill to Tara Reade, from welfare reform to the bankruptcy bill, from the drug war to DOMA.

Senator Joe Biden made the world shittier and a President Joe Biden will continue to do so (but at a slower pace than Trump). He's going to put kids in cages (with their parents!), he's going to bomb weddings, he's going to lock up whistleblowers, he's going to bargain with Mitch McConnell at the expense of my mom's Social Security, he's going to make the CEO of Blue Cross Blue Shield richer while healthcare remains as unsustainable and terrible for the average person as it is today.

Allow me to...

Is there enough of a difference to count, is the question.

― xyzzzz__

the answer is yes

24 hours, heavens to betsy! that's a year in non-pundit time

What will you do if polls show a close race in Texas, Milo?

"If I lived in a swing state, 99% chance I'd pull the lever for the Biden. I don't."

Just interested as to why you would vote for this prick if you lived in a swing state xp

but I am reading (as someone who posts in this community) how people believe Biden will not bomb Brown people

― xyzzzz,Thursday, April 16, 2020 1:20 PM (twenty-nine minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

hey can you please provide a citation for this absurd claim? Who itt has ever said that?

Biden might kill ya, Trump def wants to kill ya

kind of funny that david roberts is also having an annoying morning, on the same exact topic. he posted this like 2 minutes ago

Here's my policy, which I recommend: if someone in your TL says Biden is just as bad as Trump, or they're not going to vote, or they're going to vote third party ... don't argue. Don't give it the attention it seeks. Don't RT, even to bash it. Just quietly block & move on.

— David Roberts (@drvox) April 16, 2020

that's kind of what i mean though, with the frustration. it's not just an isolated dumb thing, it's a thing that loooooooooots of people believe

actually, i see roberts takes it further than i thought ("or they're going to vote third party" - i have no issue with that, as long as it doesn't matter)

that's funny I was just going to post this link to a v good Roberts piece: https://www.vox.com/energy-and-environment/2020/4/16/21220312/coronavirus-stimulus-renewable-energy-democrats

I swear to christ if RBG and Breyer (81 his damn self) don’t retire the very minute Biden takes the oath of office...

although if dems don’t retake the senate I don’t suppose it matters

hey can you please provide a citation for this absurd claim? Who itt has ever said that?

― Yanni Xenakis (Hadrian VIII),Thursday, 16 April 2020 bookmarkflaglink

You seemed to be listing Trump's list of foreign policy crimes as if to say Biden wouldn't be as bad. Just taking some dramatic license but my point stands.

That Roberts tweet is dumb as shit. If you can’t make a positive case for Biden, if you can’t understand why someone might not see him as a positive force in the world, that’s your problem.

Just interested as to why you would vote for this prick if you lived in a swing state xp

At this point even Biden appears to be far less likely to get us into a war with Iran. No fewer coups or drone strikes but probably not an actual honest to god (attempted) invasion.

Just taking some dramatic license but my point stands.

The exaggeration was identical to your point.

Biden doesn’t know where the fuck he is but I’m (futilely) hoping that the ppl who end up in his orbit recognize the seething rage of everyone under the age of 45 who are Left of Jim Webb

If you can’t make a positive case for Biden, if you can’t understand why someone might not see him as a positive force in the world, that’s your problem.

to flip that around, if you can't recognize that a 20,000 ft slab of concrete that extends out into space is different than a plate of rotten salami, that's your problem

the only thing a prospective leader can be fairly compared to is

what, perfection?

if you just literally dont think there should be a president of the united states prob fairer to make that explicit

At this point even Biden appears to be far less likely to get us into a war with Iran. No fewer coups or drone strikes but probably not an actual honest to god (attempted) invasion.

― Greta Van Show Feets BB (milo z),Thursday, 16 April 2020 bookmarkflaglink

1 x good argument for Biden. Finally (with the caveat Biden would escalate things back up with North Korea but that would probably just be words).

well the end goal is for there to not be a united states but we'll work that out

The bIg lesson for me in all of this—as someone who four years ago wondered if Donald Trump's lack of ideology made him less harmful than, for example, Mike Pence—is that in this system, amorality is vastly more dangerous than immorality.

The ideologue requires an countervailing opposition, without which he has no oxygen. He can be engaged on (broadly) shared terms, and because he forwards his ideology on moral grounds (whatever their merit), his actions can be called into question. Tacit in his assertion of ideas is that ideas exist, that some are better than others.

The amoralist isn't going to fight back, he doesn't even believe in the most corrupt system. There's nothing there, you're punching a ghost. In another system—in a truly representative democracy with genuine checks on power and inequality—this kind of cipher would have no traction. But *this* system is designed for him. All he needs to do is climb on board, after that the damage unfolds almost on its own.

1 x good argument for Biden. Finally

wait, is this actually what you're looking for? arguments in favor of biden over trump? you...can't see them already?

let me blow your mind: i bet joe biden wouldn't appoint his son-in-law to lead 20+ different initiatives ranging from the opiod crisis to israel/palestine peace. wow!

+ 1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

who would he appoint tho

hold on, gotta hit google

i don't want to jump the gun, but i am quickly running across MULTIPLE ITEMS THAT SUGGEST BIDEN WOULD BE BETTER THAN TRUMP

i kind of want to post it here to vet it with you all, but i'm thinking this could finally be my viral piece for the atlantic that shoots me to fame

end goal is for there to not be a united states but we'll work that out

plz make sure that, as a preliminary step, you eliminate assault weapons or there might be some undesirable complications with this plan

Just taking some dramatic license but my point stands.
― xyzzzz__,Thursday, April 16, 2020 2:18 PM (eleven minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

well, no, it doesn't, not if that license completely distorts what someone said

holy shit. have you all heard of something called CORONAVIRUS