outbreak! (ebola, sars, coronavirus, etc)

Thanks Nixon

more on that in the uk politics thread

it's the uk equiv of the big nytimes article about trump's february. both of these guys were just MIA.

Hence the extensive coverage on the BBC... oh, hold on...

Sorry can’t search on phone. I assume the latest Ed Yong piece has been linked here? https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/04/pandemic-summer-coronavirus-reopening-back-normal/609940/

It’s very good on the facts (he always is) but the last section on resilience is particularly good imo.

Sort of settling in to the idea that even if certain activities resume there’s no good reason for me/anyone who can to stop working from home before a vaccine exists.

I will work my way thru that article after my chores. It looks excellent.

Meanwhile just want to share a post showing that anti-quarantine protests are centrally coordinated.

"There's an imperial ton of astroturfing going on, and it's quite visible in how those groups popped up literally overnight."

https://www.reddit.com/r/maryland/comments/g3niq3/i_simply_cannot_believe_that_people_are/fnstpyl/

Have any major outlets investigated this?

i'd love it if we could get those people arrested

That Ed Yong article is fucking grim. People who are already made anxious by the State of Modern Pod/Bunker Living are gonna flip the fuck out by the time we hit Months Six through Twelve. Me, I'm trying to figure out what kind of argument I can make for continuing to work remotely if my employer does ask people to start showing up again. Maybe I'll have to tell them I'm a diabetic (true) and therefore especially vulnerable.

I am deeply skeptical of these astroturf accusations, dummies on the right make these same accusations all the time when there's a protest they don't like—"it's George Soros!"

The really sad fact is that "astroturfing" isn't necessary. That's what's scary. They have the entire weight of FOX behind them, maniacal talk radio, the president cheering them on. The fact that people are making the same signs and circulating the same copy is meaningless—that's how these things unfold on FB Twitter etc., which also makes it very easy to coordinate things at teh drop of a hat.

A random chiropractor sparked the madness in Michigan.

It's just kind of stupid to think that the Koch Brothers or whatever must be financing and organizing these idiots. They're perfectly capable of being stupid on their own—they elected this asshole in the first place.

And it doesn't really matter anyway if news orgs are going to take them seriously either way

The DeVos and Koch families, et al, have ALWAYS worked by funding secret actions. It's so in character it's practically unnecessary to point it out. As usual, the right (mostly) falsely accuses the left of doing exactly what it, itself, is doing.

What a world we live in

Incredible images of two nurses who launched a counter protest by standing in front of a car parade of protestors in Denver (via Alyson McClaran) pic.twitter.com/PgR74Sj5QE

— Don Moynihan (@donmoyn) April 20, 2020

There's a mountain of evidence behind the astroturfing of the Tea Party, a reasonable start here (between the DeVos clan and the weirdo collecting open state X domain) - and zero evidence of Soros or anyone else fomenting BLM or Occupy. The closest thing to 'both sides do it' is some astroturfing against Medicare For All.

A cautionary tale from Singapore on relaxing lockdowns too soon as well as a lesson on how to treat migrant worker populations:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/18/asia/singapore-coronavirus-response-intl-hnk/index.html

Thanks, Roz. I was astonished to read about the migrant workers---how they live, how they are treated bureaucratically by the government---and it's spurred me to learn more about their situation (independently of the virus).

sadly, exploitation of migrant workers is common across all of Southeast Asia, not just in Singapore but also Malaysia and Brunei, as well as ME countries like Qatar and Saudi. The situation is the same everywhere - cramped, unhygienic living conditions, little to no access to health or medical services, extremely low pay, debt bondage, etc.

Thanks. Do you have texts you'd recommend for learning more about this, in English or in French? I suppose in some sense I've known about this for a while, having read about workers in Dubai, but I was triggered by the comment by the Singaporean lawyer who said that these workers were "indispensable", for that seems to code a lot. I'm interested in understanding better the working conditions of these workers; how these workers see their lives in relation to their home countries and to the countries in which they work; their bureaucratic situation with respect to both countries; and how citizens of the countries in which they work think about these workers, and their roles in this exploitation.

I don't have anything specific but this recent survey by the UN on attitudes towards migrant workers in Southeast Asia is instructive: http://www.ilo.org/asia/media-centre/news/WCMS_732449/lang--en/index.html

Andy Hall is also a good person to follow on migrants rights issues in the region. He's based out of Bangkok (though heavily focused on Malaysia at the moment): https://twitter.com/Atomicalandy

thanks!

There's a mountain of evidence behind the astroturfing of the Tea Party

No doubt, atsrorturfing is real. My point was that in this case it's not necessarily top-down or conspiratorial—or even political. It's just the fruit of a fucked up system in which fear/anger can be exploited for a buck. This is a good post on the two companies facilitating/encouraging a lot of the protests:

https://www.reddit.com/r/MassMove/comments/g3toiz/a_post_by_udr_midnight_collating_information_on/fnv8j69/

astroturfing is real of course but...

Do you think that, absent provocation from moneyed interests, that these gun-nut libertarian prepper birther meatheads would have been acting like good altruistic citizens?

have there been 'reopen everything' protests anywhere else in the world?

Gun-nut libertarian prepper meatheads didn't get that way overnight, the powers who benefit from their meatheadedness have been preparing them for decades. It's not like we started with a neutral playing field and these people are just the bad apples. They've been grown this way.

xxp No of ocurse not. They'd still be getting together to own the libs.

have there been 'reopen everything' protests anywhere else in the world?

― mookieproof, Monday, April 20, 2020 5:12 PM (fourteen minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

lol

I found the local anti-shutdown group on FB. Oh dear.

have there been 'reopen everything' protests anywhere else in the world?

― mookieproof, Monday, April 20, 2020 5:12 PM (fourteen minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

lol

― Joey Corona (Euler), Monday, April 20, 2020 10:27 AM (two minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

Why lol? In Israel there have been, for instance.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/police-clash-with-stone-throwing-haredi-protesters-in-jerusalem-5-arrested/

w/r/t astroturfing: Around 6:30am, I spotted some freshly stenciled "Free The City" graffiti on the pavement in a park, the font was stylized to appear hand-drawn in a "hippy-ish" font, but was 100% stenciled. I live in the most leftist city in the US.

ok Israel is an exception

LOL seems fair comment tbh

i have the same question as mookie - anywhere else in the world that has to deal with this, except for lol israel?

"this" = anti-shelter-in-place truthers

Karl Malone my lol was: no, of course not. Israel is the exception that proves the rule, as one says.

the united states has a "special" idiotic relationship with israel

there was like 1000 at the one in Brookfield here in Wisconsin. I am guessing they'll be more this weekend in Madison. maybe FOX/Trump boosting these is having some effect. cool that we're all gonna have to stay inside another month because of these idiots

2000 in Olympia WA yesterday, I wish them all ill.

They wish everyone else ill too

'jesus is my vaccine'

The lead story on CNN right now claims “protests are erupting” and cites Maryland’s protests specifically throughout the beginning of the article. Gov. Hogan’s staff says there were more media requests to cover the protests than actual protesters.https://t.co/Sqmspl931R https://t.co/dLr7aHyP20

— Steve Krakauer (@SteveKrak) April 20, 2020

i understand that the media is blowing it up as much as they can, just like the tea party stuff. i'm sure that a lot of the nationwide "protests" really are just like a dozen people, framed advantageously by a photographer.

but then, there really were 2000+ people protesting in Olympia, yesterday, like silby said

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/demonstrators-rally-in-olympia-against-washingtons-coronavirus-stay-home-order/

as others have remarked, on this thread or one of the other ones, the tea party "movement", from the beginning, was an astroturfing campaign that was largely organized and financed by dark money organizations. but at some point, early on, the astroturfing dream succeeded - lots of old white people were convinced that the movement was real and got really excited about being racist and dumb in public together for a couple years. we might be seeing something similar here, with the coronavirus truthers

have there been 'reopen everything' protests anywhere else in the world?

In Brazil, state governors are defying Bolsonaro's call to reopen, and yesterday Bolsonaro coughed over 600 pro-dictatorship protesters at Army HQ.

xp: From where I was watching, there was a brief month-long window in Fall 2008 in which the US tea party protesters were fairly grassroots, and mostly angry about handouts to banks; but that was co-opted by Koch Bros. dark money / astroturfing within weeks.

there's been some protests in Vancouver, looked like tiny groups of people

I don't think the tea party existed in 2008 (not with that name anyway)

I think there's a lot of overlap between the people who were Newt / Contract with America fanboiz in 1994, then TEA (Taxed Enough Already! lol) Party adherents in 2009, and MAGAnauts 2016-present.

Maybe it's not the same exact people but they most def look and feel tribally aligned.

Going back further of course you will find segregationists, KKKers, and of course Lost Cause Confederacy stans. A River of White Grievance Runs Through It.

symsymsym: you're right. There was a small group called FedupUSA in 2008, and that sort of evolved through the Fall/Winter until Karl Denninger called for a "tea party" on 20 Jan 2009. Within two years Denninger was decrying its co-option.

oh

NEW from me and @AlbertSamaha: Smithfield Foods Is Blaming “Living Circumstances In Certain Cultures” For One Of America’s Largest COVID-19 Clusters https://t.co/Vke6w2uTpG

— Katie Baker (@katiejmbaker) April 20, 2020

How much is the push to open states just a drive for racial genocide under a different name?

94%