Joe Biden, Senator from Citibank (oops, DELAWARE), to Run for President

ok hands up if you aren't trolling

Go for it, silby.

I guess I was trolling just now tbf

you have to debase yourself for Florida reactionaries every time you step into Florida tbf

The only time I've been Florida was in 2000. I was in Orlando for a professional conference. The general effect it had on me felt debasing. At the time I blamed Disney Corporation, but the reactionaries may have contributed, too.

oh man being in Orlando is like a whole other species of self-debasement

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/05/14/joe-biden-latino-outreach-255282

Should be fine

Debasing yourself for Joe Biden is even more embarrassing than Joe Biden debasing himself for Florida reactionaries.

― Greta Van Show Feets BB (milo z), Saturday, May 16, 2020 12:13 AM (four hours ago)

yeah it's so gross that people actually want the democratic candidate to win the election

"It'll be the same no matter who gets in," says the white guy

Says the white guy?

It won't be massively different to make enough of a difference says a non-white person, on the internet, who can't even vote in your election.

Pretty sure there's a difference in grudgingly voting for the lesser evil and rushing in to defend turning to the Cuban Question playbook from 1974 (to be fair, Biden might currently think it's 1974).

But even better - if you live in California or DC or New York, you're not saving the world from fascism by voting for the sex creep (or outright sex criminal) with shitty views on everything. You're just gleefully voting for the sex creep (or outright sex criminal) with shitty views on everything.

wow

hopefully trump wins again to teach us all a lesson eh

it must be a wild ride not being able to hold two ideas in your head at the same time

how do you keep defaulting to the same reductive nonsense?

both of you guys though, seriously

I really don't anyone itt is gleefully voting for Biden, and neither are those of us horrified at the prospect of a Biden presidency hoping Trump wins instead

this place would be way cooler for the next six months if we could just lop off the 1% outlier takes on both ends of the spectrum

xp don't *think* anyone

Are you seriously saying milo represents an outlier? his position is well within the mainstream of current us politics thread talk. Democrats are as bad or worse than the GOP, repeat ad infinitum.

I'm sympathetic to MIlo's stance and I guess I think he's errs on the side of trolling you, unperson, et al...and that you guys do the same

I also think (and he can knock this down) that "Democrats are worse" is not an equivalency argument.

I think it's fair to argue that people who purport to share your values at the expense of upholding them are "worse" than those who don't even pretend to.

I’m well past the point of wasting my time and energy attempting to have an earnest discussion about why Democrats might actually be a tad bit better than Republicans, with any of you, really.

It’s all apparently driven by religious thinking at this point, and I’m clearly in a separate cult than the majority of posters still dense and stubborn enough to participate in these threads in the first place.

Like I don't expect anything from Wilbur Ross or Jared Kushner. Those people are snakes, and when they're gone there will be others in their place.

I do have expectations of the people who are in the position to try and disrupt that cycle, though. And when in self-interest those people co-opt and distort the principles we need to uphold to actually do that—yeah, they're "worse" in that particular, narrow sense. They're in the way.

Like I'm not gonna jump up and down yelling at my mugger. That's what he does: mugs people. But the cop who looks the other way because he knows the guy's family or whatever" "Worse."

One thing I appreciate about Joe Biden is his telling people not to vote for him -- not that I need his permission, but the directness is refreshing. And I won't. Thanks Joe! Good luck in November, if you make it that far. pic.twitter.com/Qacli9CGoP

— Dennis Perrin (@DennisThePerrin) May 15, 2020

I mean, Tombot's fighting phantoms in his head with the "oh u think Democrats are WORSE" but go on.

Biden is garbage. He has always been garbage. In the future he will continue to be garbage but increasingly confused and disconnected from the world around him. You don't have to vote for him - whether you think he's committed sexual assault or not, if you profess to hold liberal or progressive views and don't live in one of the handfuls of states that actually matter, the mere thought of voting for Biden should turn your stomach. Criticizing Joe Biden is not praising Donald Trump.

"Oh you only criticize Democrats"/'only Democrats have political agency, huh?!?!" - as ever, the Vote Blue equivalent of "well, we have a higher standard of living than Eritrea" - cool, I don't live there and have no influence over the policies of Eritrea. The Democrats are the only team with some semblance of expectations and the only team I have some vague infinitesimal influence over. We know Republicans are evil - that's one of the problems with Joe Biden, he doesn't seem to grasp that.

Donald Trump should be strung up in the town square like Mussolini, Joe Biden should just be exiled to Joshua Tree and forced to live without air conditioning.

Criticizing Joe Biden is not praising Donald Trump.

No, but not voting for Joe Biden is voting for Donald Trump. It's a binary system. You can choose A, B, or Z (which is, in terms of real world results, equivalent to choosing A).

It was unspeakably stupid for Biden to say a completely unsurprising thing about Cuba potentially joining the UN HRC because Florida something something


https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politics/fl-ne-florida-poll-fau-biden-trump-may-20200515-yzrq5cbgkrcqpjppwd4n4urogu-story.html

unperson still rong

Criticizing Joe Biden is not praising Donald Trump

you should make this your dn because evidently it needs constant reminding for some

By now, I've read hundreds of posts by xyzzz, milo, and a few other ilxors that essentially repeat the same thing week after week, endlessly making the same point about Biden being horrifyingly bad, with no suggestions about any positive actions they intend to take to address the situation, or any alternatives to just sitting on their hands during the election and insisting this will change things for the better. Being a socialist, a radical, or an anarchist is not the same as 'bitching loudly on the internet every day'. It's been tried before and it doesn't work.

Get one new idea, plz. Your last idea wore out. And it wasn't very good to begin with.

lmao

No, but not voting for Joe Biden is voting for Donald Trump

This is not true unless you don't understand math and/or the Electoral College.

I understand the concept of zero.

It was unspeakably stupid

The people to whom that move resonates will continue to vote Republican 2:1. As they always do. Licking boots doesn't help Florida numbers in communities that aren't still mad that their grandpa's sugar plantation was expropriated.

But I didn't say it was stupid. Like most everything else Biden professes to believe, it's shitty - because Cuba is as deserving of a spot on a jerkoff emoji UN body as anyone and more deserving than many (including, you know, us and many of our allies).

Being a socialist, a radical, or an anarchist is not the same as 'bitching loudly on the internet every day'. It's been tried before and it doesn't work

Aimless w/ all due respect how does it differ from your reciprocal centrist bitching

bitching loudly on the internet *is* the internet, maybe be less reactive?

It’s all apparently driven by religious thinking at this point, and I’m clearly in a separate cult than the majority of posters still dense and stubborn enough to participate in these threads in the first place.

http://imgur.com/gallery/PySdNGa

Speaking of dense, I can't embed from imgur apparently.

The people to whom that move resonates will continue to vote Republican 2:1.

Either it resonates, in which case maybe they vote Republican 1.8:1 instead of 2:1, or it doesn't resonate. If it does, that could easily be the difference between winning Florida and losing it. If it doesn't, fine, it doesn't.

Biden, unlike Trump, will follow Obama's policy and normalize relations with Cuba, dumping the Cold War practice that Americans can take a beach vacation at any country whose government commits major human rights violations they like, so long as it's not Cuba. I guess you think that's shitty but I think it's good.

... the sign that he'll normalize relations with Cuba is promising to keep them off of international bodies

Riiiiiiight. Like the China shit from weeks ago, he's running as more right-wing than Obama and criticizing Trump using conservative talking points.

bitching loudly on the internet *is* the internet

oh so that's why it sucks so fucking much

Only on ilx is aimless a centrist lol

it's just funny that it's only bitching when it's *someone else*

Only on ilx is aimless a centrist lol

No, no, no! Being in favor of universal health care, student loan forgiveness and low-cost or no-cost higher education, a wealth tax, a green new deal, reparations for slavery and Jim Crow, low-cost or no-cost child care, these are the very essence of centrism these days.

It just puzzles the heck out me how Trump got to be president when he doesn't support these things. Maybe I don't understand the electoral college. Or maybe the electoral college should be abolished. Hard to say.

as pointed out by the biden dissenters themselves the OHCHR is a joke already so rhetoric keeping Cuba off its masthead is a cost-free meaningless gesture meant to try and win over latino voters that milo was worried 12 hours ago he wasn't doing enough to win. "oh but they're not the right latinos" ok but clearly they're making statements intended to win them over. maybe consider it in pairing with his vow to restore US aid to the PLO. lose a few Jewish retirees, gain a few Cuban exilees - maybe it all washes out.

he's running as more right-wing than Obama

I completely respect that from your point of view Biden's politics are unforgivably shitty, and my understanding is that you see Obama the same way, but the idea that Biden is running to the right of Obama seems unsupportable to me. He is running on Obama nostalgia. You can criticize him for that, but the absolute center of his appeal is people who wish Obama were still President.

>No, but not voting for Joe Biden is voting for Donald Trump

This is not true unless you don't understand math and/or the Electoral College.

― Greta Van Show Feets BB (milo z), Saturday, May 16, 2020 12:02 PM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

I understand that Biden led Trump in a recent Texas poll.

Aimless, to be fair to comrade alphabet, he has done his part as a canvasser in the buildup to last year's UK general election, to cite the one example I'm aware of, so he's not just 'bitching loudly on the internet every day', although he's certainly louder than most.

as pointed out by the biden dissenters themselves the OHCHR is a joke already so rhetoric keeping Cuba off its masthead is a cost-free meaningless gesture meant to try and win over latino voters that milo was worried 12 hours ago he wasn't doing enough to win. "oh but they're not the right latinos" ok but clearly they're making statements intended to win them over.

So he's using a right-wing talking point - that's wrong and shitty - to appeal to a group of people who aren't going to be swayed regardless. Saying anything to theoretically win a random group of people is not a neutral act - would it just be la-di-da if he starts repeating his old line about abortion not being a right? There are way more pro-lifers than people who give a shit about Cuba.

I completely respect that from your point of view Biden's politics are unforgivably shitty, and my understanding is that you see Obama the same way, but the idea that Biden is running to the right of Obama seems unsupportable to me. He is running on Obama nostalgia. You can criticize him for that, but the absolute center of his appeal is people who wish Obama were still President.

You left out the first clause - 'Like the China shit from weeks ago.'

On foreign policy - thus far Iran, China and Cuba - he's running to Obama's right and criticizing Trump from the right.

he has done his part as a canvasser in the buildup to last year's UK general election

I highly commend him for that. But since comrade alphabet cannot take similar active measures in our next election here in the USA, I wish he'd be a bit less active in trying to suppress voter turnout here, or at least encourage some form of active participation he thinks might lead in a helpful direction.