Joe Biden, Senator from Citibank (oops, DELAWARE), to Run for President

When LBJ pushed through the CRA and VRA, public opinion of MLK and the Civil Rights Movement was like 80-20 horribly negative and it directly cost the Democrats A lot of elections for decades.

Whether moral or merely political (somehow), the abdication or leadership by liberals over the past 50 years has been a fundamental problem. When Democrats have taken the lead it has been in service of the project of deregulating capital. And yet, the only winning Democrats of most of our lives ran campaigns centered on changing the status quo rather than maintaining it.

Whiney: fuck off and die

silby: use better websites

Somehow “America is ALREADY Great” didn’t resonate quite enough with a mass of people living in terror of getting sick or laid off.

I’d be impressed how much more intelligent and worthwhile your posting has become if it hadn’t required so much genuine vitriol on my part to encourage it.

Tombot, you’re a bully and not even very good at being one. You get madder than your targets.

You’re a schmuck and nobody likes you

The heart breaks, but nevertheless you remain an attempted bully. There's always been someone or a different clique 'posting wrong' to get you riled up about ILX going to the dogs, yet it's always you who's mad and yelling and trying to insult people.

yet you remain, bravely committed to drag everything and everyone down to your level in the name of moral superiority about American politics

Perhaps the problem is that American politics is so deeply amoral

Whose heart breaks? Not yours, you haven’t gaf in years. You’re Leftist Texas Fred

Oh boy Whiney sprinkling deep insights

Tomboto - if Biden does all that, or tries to, will anyone pay attention at this point? If Biden wants to re-start the Iran deal, why should Iran trust that we won't just elect another Trump? Why should the Kurds ever accept our allyship? Why should NATO countries treat us like a leader again?

These are great questions! Do you think electing Trump again will help? How about another GOP-controlled Senate? Does that help? Let me know what you think helps.

they won't trust us for a long time, but you can't possibly think that's a reason not to support Biden

It remains the case that if Joe Biden loses it won’t be because of our posts about how he’s bad

I don't want either of those things, thanks, very good questions. I was really hopeful about Sanders for a brief moment because it felt like someone with decent instincts about what America should and shouldn't be doing in the world might be directing foreign policy. I think that might have helped, because it would have a been a relatively drastic shift in how America presented itself to the world. Feel free to call me a naive moron for thinking that. But if you're going to lecture milo about how foreign policy is serious business and he's refusing to engage with reality in order to keep the moral high ground, maybe it's worth taking into account that this country has zero credibility as a world leader at this point, and not just because of Trump.

I wonder if positions will start to become more entrenched soon

they won't trust us for a long time, but you can't possibly think that's a reason not to support Biden

If you live in Florida, should that be the argument that makes you vote for Vermin Supreme? Probably not.

But it’s not as if, were you a voter in Illinois or Wyoming, you can’t factor in to your voting decision how little his foreign policy is going to actually change things and the extent to which he shares responsibility for why we’ve gotten to this place (ie Iraq + Vice President Drone Strike).

“Probably not” this fucking dumbass

As I recall, Obama was viewed as a credible leader by much of the world. But veering around from Bush to Obama to Trump tends to plant serious doubts that our government is wholly unreliable from one administration to the next and will be so long as US voters demonstrate such wild inconsistency.

your disrespect for everyone you interact with is homestly amazing

Xp, intended for milo “green party” z obv

Voters were pretty consistent from Obama to Trump, the electoral college wasn’t.

You’re so mad you can’t recognize offhand sarcasm, bro. Smoke a blunt and chill.

Please ban yourself, you insufferable twit.

Casual sarcasm, when translated to a text interface on the internet, is flattened to the point where it generally fails to convey sarcasm. Try it sometime and see.

I think trying to explain things to milo just makes him cackle harder

Tomboto seriously I think you're looking for things to get enraged by in that last post. you're being way more aggressive and insulting than milo at this point.

nah it started this way

I’m exorcising many, many months of unpleasantness tonight, yes. I really don’t care what you think.

milo sucks at posting, he drives off other posters, he thinks it’s all hilarious, and I fucking hate him.

Man there’s better choices of posters to lose your shit at

Some ppl itt really need to get out more tbh

Thats not good advice right now

depends on yer perspective

I don’t know of that many other posters who gleefully drive fellow posters off the board and then keep on truckin’ with the same formula and single-minded certainty as our man milo zed

I tried to drive someone off the board but got tempbanned for it smh

The unfettered dgafness of his approach to these threads, on and on and on, despite several people pointing out the repetition, the repetition, and how we got the point, we got the point; it’s enough. I’ve had enough.

It remains the case that if Joe Biden loses it won’t be because of our posts about how he’s bad

this "Joe Biden sucks" thread is 15 years old next month, we might accidentally fill it up and start making posts about how he's bad on ILX's one "Joe Biden rules" thread, that sways the votes of a nation

Can I distract u by asking u to explain what NATO is for, I probably know less about it than Donald Trump

Once upon a time there was a country called the Soviet Union

Other countries were scared of it, even us (but we rarely said so)

Needless to say I have no idea what you’re talking about but you told someone to “fuck off and die” like half an hour ago.

The countries on its western border - “the west” - joined us in an agreement of collective defense. An attack on one would be treated as an attack on all.

Everyone liked this agreement and it kept the borders with the scary Soviet Union stable until 1989, when things got weird.

Since then, the Soviet Union fell apart, and a lot more countries joined NATO. Why, you ask?

Because they were still afraid of Russia- the country that used to be most of the Soviet Union, and was still scary, especially for countries on its western border.

NATO is no longer just about keeping Russia at bay, though. It is an important part of how we train and build our allied military forces to take on challenges anywhere in the world when a NATO country is threatened.

biden wasn't my candidate -- i voted for sanders in the primary. (i might have voted for warren if she hadn't already dropped out by the time my state got to vote.) i have no argument with anyone who thinks that biden is a weak candidate, that he has a patchy record, or that we could have done a lot better.

i'm voting for him because a vote for biden is a vote for the democratic party to control presidential nominations, executive orders, and court appointments. and despite my various disappointments with them, the democratic party of 2020 is very different than the party of the 1990s, or even the early 2000s. the fact that someone like sanders could come so close to winning the nomination tells you everything you need to know about the difference between now and then. (was there an equivalent figure to AOC -- a popular left-wing democrat who got constant media attention -- during that era? i can't remember one.)

there are plenty of things about biden that concern me, but most of them qualify as reasons to have voted against him in the primary, not reasons to sit out the election in november. i find biden's vote for the iraq war abhorrent, but he does not seem to have been especially hawkish when he served as VP -- he didn't favor the intervention in libya, for example. i doubt i'll like his foreign policy much, and i doubt he'll end the drone war. on the other hand, considering that donald trump dramatically escalated drone bombing and has basically gotten away with it, i think the unfortunate truth is that the public doesn't care that much about this issue. that's a problem, but it's not a problem that's going to be solved by re-electing trump.

and yeah, obviously, this is just a message board where we all post under silly names and nothing we say matters. but it is genuinely odd to me that so many ppl here keep insisting that there's no real difference between biden and trump. but, yknow, so it goes.

on an unrelated note, i always find it odd that biden was considered important enough to be the subject of his own thread way back in 2005. i don't think we even had a thread for ted kennedy until he died.

And that’s the NATO story.

but it is genuinely odd to me that so many ppl here keep insisting that there's no real difference between biden and trump.

One person has done that, sort of, and said that yes a difference exists but not enough of one for him and also that person can’t vote anyway.