Dub / Reggae: An Idiot's Guide

been on a bit of a dub binge lately - Scientist, Prince Far-I, Culture (almost all at the recommendation of some other ILM dub thread - thx ILM!)

I'm really enjoying Ape-ology. I vaguely remember somebody upthread saying it's heavy, dark-ish dub/reggae, but I think the psychadelic touches (n.1) give it a lighter-touch than a lot of other (great in its own way) dub/reggae I've heard, e.g., Blood & Fire's stuff.

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(n.1) I also want to say the guitars give it a lighter sound, at least I think it's guitars I'm hearing on at least the early cuts on Super-Ape.

A lot of people would argue that Super Ape is exactly the opposite of light. Rather than being dub reduced to drum/bass/echo, it's MAXIMALIST dub with every track featuring more more more production touches, effects, instruments and even vocals. Either way it's great.

Either way it's great.

Agreed, from what I've heard so far. "Maximalist Dub" is a good term for it (unlike the more hollowed-out, minimal sound of, say, Tubby or Hudson).

"i can't think of a better reggae group from the eighties"

There's not much competition here ya know. Steel Pulse? Misty in the Roots? Reggae groups are pretty much the minority anyway.

Guess Whose Coming To Dinner, by Black Uhuru, is good (the song, I mean; I haven't had enough time to consider the whole disc).

It's a good album too. Probably their best.

Shine Eye Dub is my Uhuru of choice.

steel pulse is pretty awes. i really want to hear 'rally round' now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqYT1HWEcF8

what no love for ASWAD

"i can't think of a better reggae group from the eighties."

There's not much competition here ya know.

Fairly or not, I've felt like Jamaican music went downhill fast in the 80s, once it went digital and morphed into dancehall and its progeny. I must need an "Idiot's Guide to Jamaican Music from the 80s to Present." (Actually I probably need an "Idiot's Guide" to everything).(n.1)

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(n.1) As I said elsewhere on these threads, I've got that Greensleeves compilation -- From Dubplate to Download -- but I just can't warm to it (not yet, at least).

I love reggae and I love dancehall, but don't like a lot of 80s stuff. Or at least the sound used to really put me off, and I haven't gone back to re-evaluate.

wow I don't think there's any dancehall I've listened to that's POST-80s - all my favorites (Shabba, Barrington Levy, Tenor Saw, etc.) are all 80s dudes.

Much as I love all the other periods, I think 80s dancehall and ragga is probably my fave reggae era.

And this is my hero

I gave up on dancehall around the time of Shaggy's first hits

Early-80s pre-digital dancehall is great (although yeah kind of overshadowed a bit by what preceded it and what came after.) For Barrington Levy, Yellowman and Eek-A-Mouse alone a classic period, but there is plenty of other greatness out there.

Y'all need to hear this one too

This is sooooooo fantastic:

http://www.discogs.com/release/223248

Oh yeah, "Rocking of the 5000" is a stone classic.

Immediately post-Shaggy was when dancehall got GREAT again!

80s dancehall and it's progeny always come off as too cold and lyrically hard-edged to me. And I can't explain why that's been off-putting for me; I mean, I like plenty of other types of lyrically hard-edged music (from old murder ballads like Pretty Polly to to new rap acts like Ghostface and unapologetic celebrations of violence, like Drive-By Trucker's Sinkhole). Something different about 80s dancehall-type stuff that I can't warm to but for reasons I can't articulate well. I definitely don't like the homophobia and misogyny in it.

Sorry for the rambling post.

Admit that last year or two I've been too busy to keep up much with new dancehall or really new anything. It's a lot of work.

There is shitloads of 80s stuff that's not homophobic or misogynist. If anything I feel like homophobic lyrics were a lot bigger from the 90s on. Check out something like this:

http://www.discogs.com/release/1026208

and see if you don't change your mind.

I can get that on eMusic! Thanks, NV, I'll try it.

If you just try 1 track, get the JC Lodge and Tiger song. Sweet vocal interplay, total badass bassline.

as far as dancehall goes for me, harder & more syncopated = better, so the stuff that really gets me excited is post-'00s.

Jordan have you heard any soca?

no!

Hah well I would give it a shot. It is the harder more syncopated side of dancehall in a lot of ways.

And this is my hero

-- Noodle Vague, Monday, 3 March 2008 22:55

NO WANGA GUT NO WANGA BELLY

looking up some random stuff on youtube...is it all this uptempo (and happy)?

That Tiger video is funny. Reminds me of the "homemade"-type videos I liked so much in the early days of MTV, when things happened for no reason in a video except that the artist and/or director thought it would be entertaining (to themselves, at least).

"looking up some random stuff on youtube...is it all this uptempo (and happy)?"

Haha yeah mostly.

re: congos being overrated

this is truly an idiot's guide

well, elan, ni gistubus non disputandum and all that. and i feel olde saying i've listened to lots of reggae over the last 25+ years and that record did not hold up for me

haha, maybe not for me then.

De gustibus non est disputandum = GREAT PHRASE and certainly true. Except here, since Heart Of The Congos, is indisputably fantastic.

(j/k)

This is sooooooo fantastic:

http://www.discogs.com/release/223248

i heard this a long time ago and wasn't into it. i'll have to give it another chance

Do you no like Scientist, am0n?

re: congos being overrated

this is truly an idiot's guide

well, elan, ni gistubus non disputandum and all that. and i feel olde saying i've listened to lots of reggae over the last 25+ years and that record did not hold up for me

-- outdoor_miner,

I'll probably be shot down for this as well but I'm not a huge fan of that record either. There's only so much falsetto I can take in one sitting. I still love Perry's production on it of course.

Real question for non-Congos fans. Do you generally like Jamaican harmony groups (Mighty Diamonds, Gladiators, Abyssinians, Meditations, Royals, Wailers, etc) or are you mostly a fan of solo singers and deejays?

I'd have to say the latter, but mainly because I've heard very little from those groups unfortunately.

@Alex: nah i like scientist, i probably heard that before i was into that kind of 80s/junjo period stuff

on separate note - i really can't hang with those uk reggae bands, steel pulse, uhuru, etc. rock guitar solos? - no thanks

Uhuru are def. not UK.

Also don't remember too many solos on Love Crisis, Showcase, Sinsemilla, Guess Who's Coming To Dinner. Seriously great Sly & Robbie stuff though (actually the first is Jammy, I think, but still.)

ahah i'm confusing them with Aswad

see that steel pulse youtube upthread re: guitar solo

I'm not a huge UK reggae band fan actually. I much prefer the lover's stuff from the same period.

Aswad's Live and Direct is a total jam, probably the only Aswad you need to own. Misty in Roots are my favourite British reggae act, pretty much all of their stuff is worthwhile.