there's a handful of centrist ultra-dads who i've always been on perfectly affable professional terms with (bcz FITING ONLINE is not really my thing) who i honestly permanently now want to say this to: "in 20 years your children will absolutely despise you and YOU WILL HAVE EARNED THIS"
and i'm right and as a so-called friend i probably should actually find a way to say this out loud bcz they shd be thinking abt it (maybe less abruptly, meaning if i shd work out a way that's actually effective lol)
but it also feels like energies diverted to a pointless mini-arena -- they are all ppl who if the tide genuinely turned (whatever this means) wd brainlessly swing along with it so. so maybe im not really friends with them in any way any more. this is a debilitating thing to process: i come from a generation which built itself several quite bad vehicles for solidarity at a time when solidarity was under attack and i think my instinct since the 90s has been to hunt for better vehicles* rather than seize the wheel and fruitlessly attempt to steer the old bad vehicle in a better direction
*dril-standom and channer meme repurposing
― mark s, Thursday, 3 December 2020 12:47 (three years ago) link
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/623/463/d90.jpg
― mark s, Thursday, 3 December 2020 12:48 (three years ago) link
I was listening to archBlairite and professional bigot Trevor Phillips talking about his 80s lefty friends and he described Piers Corbyn as a "one of the most intelligent people I ever met at college"!
― calzino, Thursday, 3 December 2020 12:52 (three years ago) link
Lol Boris has a piece still out there in the Telegraph where he consulted Piers Corbyn about climate change (!)
― scampus fugit (gyac), Thursday, 3 December 2020 12:57 (three years ago) link
does Piers think that's a made-up conspiracy too?
― Uptown Top Scamping (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 December 2020 12:59 (three years ago) link
lol i saw an extract on twitter recently of a high-end maths paper that cited one t.kaczynski and there was a footnote that simply said: "better known subsequently for other work"
― mark s, Thursday, 3 December 2020 13:02 (three years ago) link
in conclusion intelligence is a trap
xxp https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/jan/24/piers-corbyn-other-rebel-in-the-family-jeremy-corbyn-climate-change
― scampus fugit (gyac), Thursday, 3 December 2020 13:24 (three years ago) link
oh, Pierspaws
― Uptown Top Scamping (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 December 2020 13:48 (three years ago) link
How old are their kids, Mark, are we sure they don't already despise them?
― Andrew Farrell, Thursday, 3 December 2020 14:42 (three years ago) link
SM’s kids are full Corbynistas.
― scampopo (suzy), Thursday, 3 December 2020 14:44 (three years ago) link
the ones i have in mind are still infants i think, or tweens at most
― mark s, Thursday, 3 December 2020 17:37 (three years ago) link
From a distance it really seems like the TERFy bullshit is so much more a prevailing thing in the UK than elsewhere, so many more journos/public figures weirdly making it central to their identities. Why?!?
― Tsar Bombadil (James Morrison), Friday, 4 December 2020 01:47 (three years ago) link
https://theoutline.com/post/6536/british-feminists-media-transphobic
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Friday, 4 December 2020 03:36 (three years ago) link
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/07/opinion/terf-trans-women-britain.html
― ufo, Friday, 4 December 2020 04:13 (three years ago) link
Thanks for the links.
I had no idea of the links back to homoeopathy skepticism. Seems a weird path to some fucked up conclusions.
― Clean-up on ILX (onimo), Friday, 4 December 2020 08:54 (three years ago) link
The UK Skeptic movement was always much broader than homeopathy iirc and links back to the roots of a lot of the militant Centrist stuff you see now.
― Scampo di tutti i Scampi (ShariVari), Friday, 4 December 2020 10:34 (three years ago) link
it seemed to include a lot of ex-leftists starting to embrace centrist and to some extent far right politics (without necessarily recognising it at such, or as politics at all)
― Left, Friday, 4 December 2020 10:40 (three years ago) link
maybe that’s just 90s/00s liberalism in general
― Left, Friday, 4 December 2020 10:41 (three years ago) link
It's interesting how easily you (well, me) could be dragged into a community of that easy logical scientific language in a group that considered itself full of rational sceptics but somehow ended up campaigning to inspect people's genitals in swimming pools.
― Clean-up on ILX (onimo), Friday, 4 December 2020 10:48 (three years ago) link
this is about a previous incident but aside from a few specifics is relevant to more recent stuff too
https://newsocialist.org.uk/on-the-guardians-transphobic-centrism/
liberal UK media’s deafening silence over the US right wing funding of UK transphobia as an anti-gay, anti-feminist wedge issue needs to be thrown in their faces at every opportunity
also touched on is the deep connection between trans issues and the issues around sex work, policing, prison, borders, capitalism, that these people (guardian & fellow travellers, plus a lot of the ‘actual’ left) do not want to address in any serious way
all of these articles get at part of the picture but the best explanation and analysis of this whole phenomenon probably (hopefully) yet to come
― Left, Friday, 4 December 2020 11:15 (three years ago) link
xp
when so much of what binds the community is “we’re so much better than these idiots who don’t understand science” it’s not surprising that so many went on to target people who troubled their junior school understanding of sex/gender. the men mostly targeted feminists at first- at the time many seemed to think trans issues were just another part of the whole feminist ideology that they wanted to debunk. some later changed their tune on feminism when they realised how they could use it
― Left, Friday, 4 December 2020 11:39 (three years ago) link
xps to onimo, I have always been deeply suspicious of the sceptic movement due to their attitude towards women and Muslims, so it’s not as much as a leap for me. But a lot of these groups out there will cloak their intentions in reasonable sounding language, or dogwhistles, so you sound insane pointing it out.
― scampus fugit (gyac), Friday, 4 December 2020 12:13 (three years ago) link
that nytimes piece was v good, i've never heard of sophie lewis before but it did manage to wrangle in a very good overview of the rise of terfism in the uk while resisting being drawn into terfisms frames of reference
― plax (ico), Friday, 4 December 2020 12:24 (three years ago) link
the nyt one is good. i was wary of the other one, which didn’t really stack up for me but i haven’t got time or energy today to really understand why.
― Fizzles, Friday, 4 December 2020 13:26 (three years ago) link
it seems very reductive tbh
― Uptown Top Scamping (Noodle Vague), Friday, 4 December 2020 13:32 (three years ago) link
I have the NS in my rss feed and so this is the first time I've seen the page itself, text is pretty unreadable!
― Daniel_Rf, Friday, 4 December 2020 14:46 (three years ago) link
yeah that layout was yuck but i think it can be adjusted?
― Uptown Top Scamping (Noodle Vague), Friday, 4 December 2020 14:47 (three years ago) link
That their own heinous rhetoric does not, in fact, match the scientific data they purport to draw upon has not occurred to these enlightened folks, it seems.
And yeah, that NYT piece was an excellent summary.
― pomenitul, Friday, 4 December 2020 14:56 (three years ago) link
Another normal one.
There is literally no UK newspaper that stands up for trans people and especially kids. Here are the liberal lions of the Observer - an editorial, so the view of the paper itself - spouting fringe talking points and anti-science garbage. https://t.co/h6KfWCHPWU— James Mackenzie (@mrjamesmack) December 6, 2020
― xyzzzz__, Sunday, 6 December 2020 09:53 (three years ago) link
i guess they'll keep doing this as long as people keep clicking its depressing
― plax (ico), Sunday, 6 December 2020 10:31 (three years ago) link
I don't see it as click-bait. The people who wrote it would hold onto that view regardless.
― xyzzzz__, Sunday, 6 December 2020 11:28 (three years ago) link
i guess i meant more that as much as i'd like to buycott the guardian (and for us all to buycott it, and for them to come begging us to read their stupid weekend guide section on outdoor swimming) and think its an awful pile of shit i end up reading it all the time (with adblocker on ha!)
― plax (ico), Sunday, 6 December 2020 11:45 (three years ago) link
puff piece on MLC today is it
― sir kieth scamper QC (||||||||), Sunday, 6 December 2020 18:36 (three years ago) link
Oh look, it's Sunday again.
― pomenitul, Sunday, 6 December 2020 18:41 (three years ago) link
freedlands smug fucking face pushing the standard concern trolling liberal wankers party line over the phrase 'defund the police'. all the right people are just terrified of these words
― Left, Sunday, 6 December 2020 20:36 (three years ago) link
FWIW in Australia the local version of the Guardian is one of the best outlets around, which is partly because it's not as fucked as the UK version, and partly because all the competition is Murdoch sewage.
― Tsar Bombadil (James Morrison), Sunday, 6 December 2020 22:48 (three years ago) link
No newspaper is going to run an editorial opposing that high court judgement, get real.
― everything, Monday, 7 December 2020 05:14 (three years ago) link
Because?
― Uptown Top Scamping (Noodle Vague), Monday, 7 December 2020 10:19 (three years ago) link
Who or what is MLC?
― the pinefox, Monday, 7 December 2020 10:22 (three years ago) link
mlc is marie le conte, a writer many dislike or distrust
― mark s, Monday, 7 December 2020 10:42 (three years ago) link
She's a dangerous right-wing politician, President of the National Rally political party (previously named National Front) since 2011, with a brief interruption in 2017. She has been the member of the National Assembly for Pas-de-Calais's 11th constituency since 18 June 2017.
― Andrew Farrell, Monday, 7 December 2020 10:43 (three years ago) link
that's marine le pen, she's also bad
― mark s, Monday, 7 December 2020 10:49 (three years ago) link
in fairness probably slightly worse than maire le conte
― mark s, Monday, 7 December 2020 10:50 (three years ago) link
No, I'm pretty sure she's better
― Andrew Farrell, Monday, 7 December 2020 10:55 (three years ago) link
only one way to find out...
― Gary Sambrook eats substantial meals (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Monday, 7 December 2020 10:56 (three years ago) link
Oh! I always get those two mixed up
― Clean-up on ILX (onimo), Monday, 7 December 2020 10:59 (three years ago) link
What's the only way to find out?
― the pinefox, Monday, 7 December 2020 11:16 (three years ago) link
elect marie le conte prime minister of england AND president of france iirc
― mark s, Monday, 7 December 2020 11:19 (three years ago) link
im assuming the union has to sunder before this is possible
― mark s, Monday, 7 December 2020 11:20 (three years ago) link