outbreak! (ebola, sars, coronavirus, etc)

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apparently they've started to send the vaccine to palestinian doctors, but the numbers i've seen so far indicate they've sent somewhere between 2k-5k, which is, uh, not enough.

tiwa-nty one savage (voodoo chili), Monday, 1 February 2021 20:17 (three years ago) link

AP says 5,000, WSJ says 2,000 to be clear

https://apnews.com/article/middle-east-israel-coronavirus-pandemic-9cf252d0a19c1e9b1f9079ce8c203d3b

tiwa-nty one savage (voodoo chili), Monday, 1 February 2021 20:18 (three years ago) link

As I understand it the PLO is relying on WHO's COVAX project - which has been sidelined by wealthy countries (like Israel) in access to vaccine

Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Monday, 1 February 2021 22:33 (three years ago) link

PA not PLO FYI. However the PA has its own entirely separate health system. I think it would be the right thing for Israel to provide vaccines to the territories but it wouldn’t be the normal course.

longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Monday, 1 February 2021 23:55 (three years ago) link

Here I go being nice about Russia again (oh wait it’s not me, it’s The Lancet)

BREAKING: Russia’s coronavirus vaccine, Sputnik V, is 91.6 percent effective, according to a peer-reviewed study published today in the medical journal The Lancet.

The data comes from a Phase 3 study of almost 20,000 participants. https://t.co/R3XrbrNmLr

— POLITICOEurope (@POLITICOEurope) February 2, 2021

wangdalf the blight (gyac), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 15:20 (three years ago) link

Taking comfort in seeing the national daily vaccination rate creep up, at 1.4m per day now.

soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 15:23 (three years ago) link

although a bit alarmed to see we have 147 cases of UK variant here in FL in that same article

Wrong Screamed Barney (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 15:26 (three years ago) link

(in other news, the folks' side effects from 2nd vaccine are already gone)

Wrong Screamed Barney (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 15:27 (three years ago) link

Glad to hear that Neanderthal!

I have to say I'm pretty baffled by seeing which states are stepping up and which states are tripping over themselves. Can't say I ever would have predicted West Virginia to be among the best in the country.

soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 15:28 (three years ago) link

Here I go being nice about Russia again (oh wait it’s not me, it’s The Lancet)

It's cool, I approve of this. Carry on.

pomenitul, Tuesday, 2 February 2021 15:29 (three years ago) link

lol otm re: WV

Wrong Screamed Barney (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 15:34 (three years ago) link

We Dutch seem to get the short hand of the stick again, having bet on the Janssen vaccine which has only 66% efficacy (idk if that means 1 in 3 will get the rona anyway, or you're 1/3 less protected, or...). Inject Sputnik V into my veins p please yes.

A Scampo Darkly (Le Bateau Ivre), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 15:40 (three years ago) link

sigue sigue, Sputnik!

The Man, DeLorean (onimo), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:11 (three years ago) link

We Dutch seem to get the short hand of the stick again, having bet on the Janssen vaccine which has only 66% efficacy (idk if that means 1 in 3 will get the rona anyway, or you're 1/3 less protected, or...). Inject Sputnik V into my veins p please yes.


Supposedly this is higher than most flu vaccines?

wangdalf the blight (gyac), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:12 (three years ago) link

Yep.

pomenitul, Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:16 (three years ago) link

sigue sigue, Sputnik!

― The Man, DeLorean (onimo), Tuesday, February 2, 2021 8:11 AM (seven minutes ago)

Shoot it up

Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:20 (three years ago) link

It may well be, I don't know. I've heard a lot of "experts" explain the efficacy differently, I just don't really know what it means? Does a 95% eff. vaccine protect your for 95%? Does it mean 1 in 20 will get it anyway?

I'm not worried about it, to be honest, it just seems odd to be lower by such a big percentage. I suppose big pharma isn't the industry for solidarity, y'know, helping each other out getting the highest efficacy and then all making the same, best vaccin for everyone.

xp tp gyac

A Scampo Darkly (Le Bateau Ivre), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:20 (three years ago) link

ffs not top, xp!

A Scampo Darkly (Le Bateau Ivre), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:20 (three years ago) link

Ffs I'm posting with 43% of efficacy here, apols

A Scampo Darkly (Le Bateau Ivre), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:21 (three years ago) link

wear gloves when you type or you'll transmit it to us!

Wrong Screamed Barney (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:22 (three years ago) link

It depends what kind of vaccine doesn’t it? Oxford is lower than the two mRNA ones. Either way, it seems fairly clear that it prevents severe illness even if you do get it?

wangdalf the blight (gyac), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:25 (three years ago) link

xp to Neanderthal *touches face furiously*

I totally think you're right Gyac, and I'm ok with it.

A Scampo Darkly (Le Bateau Ivre), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:29 (three years ago) link

In France, the Haute Autorité de santé just announced that they're not recommending the AstraZeneca/Oxford vaccine to over-65s due to insufficient data.

pomenitul, Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:58 (three years ago) link

jelly.gif

Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 16:59 (three years ago) link

Tbf it's true that the data for that age group is inconclusive so far. They're taking a 'wait and see' approach.

pomenitul, Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:01 (three years ago) link

Not going to do anything for the takeup in France ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

wangdalf the blight (gyac), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:02 (three years ago) link

Other European countries have adopted a similar stance fwiw. I'm very curious to see what will happen in Canada, as it hasn't even been approved here yet.

pomenitul, Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:03 (three years ago) link

Part of the context is EU beef with AstraZeneca, no? Contractual stuff

All cars are bad (Euler), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:03 (three years ago) link

Yep. Love it when petty politics and medicine mix.

pomenitul, Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:04 (three years ago) link

Vaccine efficacy of, say, 90% means that during the course of a placebo-controlled trial, there were 10% as many infections in the vaccine group as in the placebo group. The theory being, if the two groups are similar in all other respects, the same number of infections in the same timeframe would've been observed in both groups. The infections not observed in the treatment group constitute the efficacy.

Canon in Deez (silby), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:05 (three years ago) link

(not an expert!)

Canon in Deez (silby), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:07 (three years ago) link

I thought this was important info:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/01/briefing/vaccination-myanmar-coup-rochester-police.html

Here’s the key fact: All five vaccines with public results have eliminated Covid-19 deaths. They have also drastically reduced hospitalizations. “They’re all good trial results,” Caitlin Rivers, an epidemiologist at Johns Hopkins University, told me. “It’s great news.”

Many people are instead focusing on relatively minor differences among the vaccine results and wrongly assuming that those differences mean that some vaccines won’t prevent serious illnesses. It’s still too early to be sure, because a few of the vaccine makers have released only a small amount of data. But the available data is very encouraging — including about the vaccines’ effect on the virus’s variants.

“The vaccines are poised to deliver what people so desperately want: an end, however protracted, to this pandemic,” as Julia Marcus of Harvard Medical School recently wrote in The Atlantic.

Why is the public understanding more negative than it should be? Much of the confusion revolves around the meaning of the word “effective.”
What do we care about?

In the official language of research science, a vaccine is typically considered effective only if it prevents people from coming down with any degree of illness. With a disease that’s always or usually horrible, like ebola or rabies, that definition is also the most meaningful one.

But it’s not the most meaningful definition for most coronavirus infections.

Whether you realize it or not, you have almost certainly had a coronavirus. Coronaviruses have been circulating for decades if not centuries, and they’re often mild. The common cold can be a coronavirus. The world isn’t going to eliminate coronaviruses — or this particular one, known as SARS-CoV-2 — anytime soon.

Yet we don’t need to eliminate it for life to return to normal. We instead need to downgrade it from a deadly pandemic to a normal virus. Once that happens, adults can go back to work, and children back to school. Grandparents can nuzzle their grandchildren, and you can meet your friends at a restaurant.

As Dr. Ashish Jha, the dean of the Brown University School of Public Health, told me this weekend: “I don’t actually care about infections. I care about hospitalizations and deaths and long-term complications.”
The data

By those measures, all five of the vaccines — from Pfizer, Moderna, AstraZeneca, Novavax and Johnson & Johnson — look extremely good. Of the roughly 75,000 people who have received one of the five in a research trial, not a single person has died from Covid, and only a few people appear to have been hospitalized. None have remained hospitalized 28 days after receiving a shot.

To put that in perspective, it helps to think about what Covid has done so far to a representative group of 75,000 American adults: It has killed roughly 150 of them and sent several hundred more to the hospital. The vaccines reduce those numbers to zero and nearly zero, based on the research trials.

Zero isn’t even the most relevant benchmark. A typical U.S. flu season kills between five and 15 out of every 75,000 adults and hospitalizes more than 100 of them.

I assume you would agree that any vaccine that transforms Covid into something much milder than a typical flu deserves to be called effective. But that is not the scientific definition. When you read that the Johnson & Johnson vaccine was 66 percent effective or that the Novavax vaccine was 89 percent effective, those numbers are referring to the prevention of all illness. They count mild symptoms as a failure.

“In terms of the severe outcomes, which is what we really care about, the news is fantastic,” Dr. Aaron Richterman, an infectious-disease specialist at the University of Pennsylvania, said.
The variants

What about the highly contagious new virus variants that have emerged in Britain, Brazil and South Africa? The South African variant does appear to make the vaccines less effective at eliminating infections.

Fortunately, there is no evidence yet that it increases deaths among vaccinated people. Two of the five vaccines — from Johnson & Johnson and Novavax — have reported some results from South Africa, and none of the people there who received a vaccine died of Covid. “People are still not getting serious illness. They’re still not dying,” Dr. Rebecca Wurtz of the University of Minnesota School of Public Health told me.

The most likely reason, epidemiologists say, is that the vaccines still provide considerable protection against the variant, albeit not quite as much as against the original version. Some protection appears to be enough to turn this coronavirus into a fairly normal disease in the vast majority of cases.

“This variant is clearly making it a little tougher to get the most vigorous response that you would want to have,” Dr. Francis Collins, director of the National Institutes of Health, said. “But still, for severe disease, it’s looking really good.”

What would an expert do?

The biggest caveat is the possibility that future data will be less heartening. Johnson & Johnson and Novavax, for example, have issued press releases about their data, but no independent group has yet released an analysis. It will also be important to see much more data about how the vaccines interact with the variants.

But don’t confuse uncertainty with bad news. The available vaccine evidence is nearly as positive as it could conceivably be. And our overly negative interpretation of it is causing real problems.

Some people worry that schools cannot reopen even after teachers are vaccinated. Others are left with the mistaken impression that only the two vaccines with the highest official effectiveness rates — from Moderna and Pfizer — are worth getting.

In truth, so long as the data holds up, any of the five vaccines can save your life.

Last week, Dr. William Schaffner of Vanderbilt University told my colleague Denise Grady about a conversation he had with other experts. During it, they imagined that a close relative had to choose between getting the Johnson & Johnson vaccine now or waiting three weeks to get the Moderna or Pfizer vaccine. “All of us said, ‘Get the one tomorrow,’” Schaffner said. “The virus is bad. You’re risking three more weeks of exposure as opposed to getting protection tomorrow.”

DJI, Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:20 (three years ago) link

jvc, i don't know if you read about this, but the reasons WV's vaccine rollout has been so effective is that they didn't contract with the big corporate pharmacies, unlike many other states. as a result, local clinics, traveling clinics, hospitals, and small local pharmacies have been doing the heavy lifting for vaccination...surprise! Big corporate chains and the free market aren't actually good at doing a public health!

The return of our beloved potatoes (the table is the table), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:22 (three years ago) link

I did actually see that table, still safe to say its an outcome I wouldn't have predicted a year ago. Isn't it partially also because they just don't have as many CVS/Walgreen's as other states?

soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:25 (three years ago) link

exactly— those stores couldn't see getting a good ROI in a lot of parts of the state, so they just never brought stores there.

The return of our beloved potatoes (the table is the table), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:26 (three years ago) link

In case you just scrolled by, here is the relevant bit:

By those measures, all five of the vaccines — from Pfizer, Moderna, AstraZeneca, Novavax and Johnson & Johnson — look extremely good. Of the roughly 75,000 people who have received one of the five in a research trial, not a single person has died from Covid, and only a few people appear to have been hospitalized. None have remained hospitalized 28 days after receiving a shot.

DJI, Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:28 (three years ago) link

Big corporate chains and the free market aren't actually good at doing a public health!

Thank u_u table, for that point.

Ima Gardener (in orbit), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:51 (three years ago) link

If CVS received a kickback for patients who died after vaccination, the CEO would personally poison each individual vial

Wrong Screamed Barney (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 17:55 (three years ago) link

jvc, i don't know if you read about this, but the reasons WV's vaccine rollout has been so effective is that they didn't contract with the big corporate pharmacies, unlike many other states. as a result, local clinics, traveling clinics, hospitals, and small local pharmacies have been doing the heavy lifting for vaccination...surprise! Big corporate chains and the free market aren't actually good at doing a public health!

― The return of our beloved potatoes (the table is the table), Tuesday, February 2, 2021 12:22 PM (fifty-eight minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

when this fucker gets recalled by anti-tax anti-mask cranks he's going to deserve it https://laist.com/2021/02/01/head-scratching_over_newsoms_choice_of_blue_shield_to_lead_vaccination_push.php

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 18:23 (three years ago) link

apparently Pfizer believes its vaccine still provides strong protection even against the South African variant, even if not as good as their usual 94%, but will 'change' the vaccine if needed.

also, can someone (caek? Plasmon?) translate this: https://investors.modernatx.com/news-releases/news-release-details/moderna-covid-19-vaccine-retains-neutralizing-activity-against

does this mean Moderna showed its vaccine is effective even against the SA variant?

Wrong Screamed Barney (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 21:40 (three years ago) link

nevermind, found in another article: "But the company also says that when its vaccine was used against the variant initially found in South Africa, known as B.1.351, the vaccine produced levels of virus-fighting antibody titers that were around sixfold less than when it's used against other variants."

Wrong Screamed Barney (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 21:42 (three years ago) link

The vaccines that have been approved now can all be tweaked pretty fast if there are any new variants that evade immune response enough to be a serious concern.

wangdalf the blight (gyac), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 22:13 (three years ago) link

yeah I have not being following this in a huge amount of detail, but i am not yet worried about the implications of variants for vaccines.

i am worried about their implications for countries that are failing to vaccinate people because of incompetence or corruption or whatever.

the UK should be fine fwiw

Targets scorecards 🎯 on 2 February

Based on 7-day 1st doses average (399,055):

✅15M by 15 Feb (1 day early on 14/02)
✅32M by 15 Apr (17 days early on 29/03)
✅53M by Sept (123 days early on 21/05)

All targets predicted to be achieved ahead of time 👍#vaccine pic.twitter.com/7G8xJYXooo

— UK COVID-19 Vaccine Tracker (@VaccineStatusUK) February 2, 2021

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 22:55 (three years ago) link

FWIW, whatever your views on COVID (or my posts), I have found it very sanity saving to ignore most news that has "might" or "could" in the headline, or that is only based on a single study. If you otherwise have some doomscrolling tendencies, like I do, this can really help counteract those tendencies.

longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 22:58 (three years ago) link

The vaccines that have been approved now can all be tweaked pretty fast if there are any new variants that evade immune response enough to be a serious concern.

― wangdalf the blight (gyac), Tuesday, February 2, 2021 5:13 PM bookmarkflaglink

yeah and that is also reassuring. part of me is wondering if I'd get the booster as part of my trial or if I'd have to seek it out. same for my folks.

so i'm not shitting...yet.

Wrong Screamed Barney (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 22:59 (three years ago) link

xp i think we'll all be getting a booster at some point in the next 12 months.

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Tuesday, 2 February 2021 23:07 (three years ago) link

Good to see.

Israel: The trend continues

Further drop in cases (-40%), hospitalizations (-32%), and severely ill (-30%) among 60+ y/o in past 2 weeks

Stronger than in younger ages (note different axes)

Consider this as the pre-preprint. We hope to put out a preprint within the next day pic.twitter.com/5iv92pqaS1

— Eran Segal (@segal_eran) February 3, 2021

xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 3 February 2021 17:50 (three years ago) link


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