This is the inevitable thread for ILxors in their forties

I should make some new friends so they can die too.

I can definitely relate to that ...

only a few months into my 40s, my brain feels like it has transitioned to knowing my freewheeling, do whatever I feel like days are over, and I have more confidence in my ability to do things for myself and others.

but after the latter half of my 30s, I'm hoping the only way to look is up. the first half of my 30s were amazing, second half were bits of light sprinkled amongst lots of despair that I papered over with traveling the country, drinking, and excess concert-going.

Hey, if anyone else who is not "eligible" to post in the no boys thread wants to confront me for having started a discussion about how non-cis-men tend to view their 40s as more positive than cis-men and how that was insensitive or potentially related to the shitty cancer and death context of Colonel Poo's post in this thread ... please do so here. I don't have to work today, and I will personally apologize to anyone who was hurt.

I'm not really looking for a confrontation, but will just note that it came dangerously close to implying that grief and depression are an unsightly symptom of being a 40-something cis het male. There may or may not be a gendered element to when or how people experience these things, but it feels a lot like trivializing people's pain and vulnerability to muse upon it while they are obviously hurting.

just to be clear I know people are talking about this and I want to say that yes I found the discussion insensitive and a bit hurtful, but I also recognised that it wasn't really about me. I am not wanting to confront anyone over this, frankly I'm embarrassed about the whole thing.

Ugh and I am super sorry about that. I was mostly responding to the posts that followed that seemed to speak more to general malaise. I didn't intend to trivialize anyone's pain. As a middle-aged white woman, I end up seeing/reading a lot of posts and articles by other middle-aged white women and there is a tendency to actually speak more positively about one's 40s vs. being younger, so I wanted to talk about how gender relates to that.

I can't speak to experiencing this manifestation of grief at this time--the most intense grief I've experienced wrt aging was in my early 30s when I felt I had a lifetime of love to give a partner and a child, and no partner and no child in my present or future. Ten years later I could have chosen differently but I felt that time had passed for me. I no longer wanted to give up my body and the next 20 years of my life to center around something that would need so much of everything from me.

But in my mid 40s that's behind me now and the grieving feels a bit distant and a lot of other things I was laboring under have disappeared? I haven't been street harassed in this decade, which is A MIRACLE. Or I guess on the rare occasions that I am, I feel fine giving the finger and keeping it moving. A facet of my personal growth that I really appreciate.

helped a friend move back and helped my mother around the house and I should not be as tired and sore as I am, lol. Icy Hot for the win.

Feeling time creeping up, the ever slowly closing window on changing the way things are, seeing that any hope of a “replacement” situation being anything else than completely fucked is slim , living in basement studio in a shit neighborhood with one small window, realizing I’m a social cancer entity, making contributions to the public artistic discourse like trying to shoot bats in cave while standing in twenty feet of guano slowly sinking

Coffee break's over!

I count my 40s mostly as a respite from AIDS, seeing so many of my friends die in my 30s was incredibly painful, it was by far the most traumatic experience of my life

I am 49 (turning 50 in three months). My forties were mostly pleasant. Solid marriage, beautiful and happy children, decent work, played lots of music.

The last year has been tumultuous as fuck. Covid and everything, challenges with younger disabled kid and elder kid working through gender/identity issues. Winter tends to pull me down normally, and this one has been especially bad.

Lately I keep waking up with dread. Or the blues. Or nausea. Or all three. By noon I feel better. But yeah, it's a slog.

I wish peace and strength to everyone.

I'm turning 50 in December. Married 27 years (28 in June). No kids. My forties have been pretty good — drifted from job to job, but never felt desperate or worried about the present or the future. I think I've become a much better writer in the last few years, and have finally "broken through" in that I see my work cited in articles and books now, which is a strange feeling. My 2020 was...mostly pretty good (wrote a book, started a record label, made some money) to the point that I sometimes feel weirdly guilty about not sharing the existential, doom-is-upon-us feelings that others here and elsewhere share regularly. I haven't really been worried about catching Covid; I work from home and take precautions, always wearing a mask when I'm outside my apartment and generally standing far away from other people (though TBH I always did that anyway). And I don't really miss being out in public in group/social situations. Even when I went to jazz clubs I mostly sat by myself in a corner and listened to the music; I wasn't there to drink or make conversation. My main worry is that my lack of exercise seems to be taking its toll. My back hurts a lot, almost all the time, and I fell down twice while out walking this past week and only one of those can be absolutely attributable to hitting a patch of ice on the sidewalk — the other one just felt like my legs went out and I toppled over for no reason. That's weird, and something I hope stops happening.

Yeah, I've been feeling my age (48) more than at any point in my life. I look very young for my age and still have almost no grey hair, but the pandemic, lack of exercise, aging friends and parents, all have me hearing the clock ticking in a way I haven't before.

Question: does having kids give you a connection to the next generation and feeling younger or make you feel your age and out of touch?

This might be slight regret at not having kids, but I've wondered if it is the former.

it definitely helps you zero in on exactly how out of touch you are ime

i mean sure i now know that london kids say “sheffed” for “knifed” and “cap” for “a lie” but it is more or less unusable knowledge for me

I would think at the least parents would absorb some knowledge of the latest apps/technology/music/etc. from their kids, though that could definitely work either way.

Maybe ignorance really is bliss, lol.

having kids definitely makes me feel my age, mostly because i'm constantly hearing myself sounding just like my dad (and hating myself for it)

Dunno, having kids (in their twenties now) makes me feel I'm not as old as I actually am.

I'm in no rush to don a flat cap, wear tweed and have a long beard like people twenty years younger than me, put it that way.

I'd guess having kids gives you a keener sense of time passing and life changing. 5 years is a whole period of growth and change to observe in your kids. Whereas for me life's pretty similar to what it was 5 years ago with no such obvious indicators of change.

no cap, this thread is a shef in the guts

Anyway, there does not seem to be a 'fifties' thread, and even if there was, I'd only have two weeks to be there. So, lol.

Dunno, having kids (in their twenties now) makes me feel I'm not as old as I actually am.

I'm 47 and my youngest is not yet 2, I suspect by the time they're in they're twenties - or even teenagers - I'm going to be feeling pretty old by comparison.

Wonder if 'sheffed' comes from shiv, or chef's knife, or something more recondite.

Wel, I'd have thought so too, but it's not inevitable. Xpost

I think there is one! I remember posting in it. I think Jaq has as well? But I can't find it.

Guessing “sheffed” is a corruption of “shivved” though as I type that it occurs to me that “sheffed” may be a reference to Sheffield steel and so maybe sheffed is the older form? Certainly I’ve been hearing / reading shivved for years but sheffed is new to me.

I can say with happy certainty that I’m further out of touch than Tracer is.

That was an xpost, couldn’t imagine anyone else was musing on this, should’ve known Ledge would be.

Shiv: “probably from Romani chiv ‘blade’.” Says the internet.

Cheffed: "British slang to describe someone getting [shanked] or [knifed]. Typically used by [roadmen]."

https://definedictionarymeaning.com/topic/99302/cheffed

i.e. getting chopped up by a knife

lol a Roadman sounds like a description of an Irish construction worker from the 60's working as one of McAlpine's Fusiliers to me, but apparently it means someone who hangs out (not to be confused with hanging out washing) on the streets and stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qTY0u6Cujw
zone 2 - who you cheffed?

lyrics here: https://l-hit.com/en/1611459

"how many times have i went for my waist and they ran even though mans lacking
Aim it back then i swear i gotta tap it
Could never be me that don't bang it
Ruth who you cheffed?
Ned who you cheffed? (ned who you cheffed?)
Loose who you cheffed?
Let me not even start about kev
Your-your big man doing up gang
Incog who have you cheffed?
All these guys just rap like you ain't made non of us bled
Give a fuck what you think
Wanted to stop when it got too ten
Let me just state some names before we say they ain't got any friends
Loose got chinged up three times
Lb hold a bass
Ned got knocked out two times
Rhino got it in his face (rhino got it in his face)
Tizzy got opened wide
Ayy, rampz he already went swimming
Os, ny, tiny got it all for free who wants the ticket
Tsplash with his auntie
Femz at a party
They don't score no parks g"

Ned's got some explaining to do

turned 41 recently, though i keep forgetting that i'm 41 because pandemic birthdays don't seem real. so far it's been...okay? without getting too personal, i'm coming out the other end from some existential am i going to have kids or not? stuff that i do think, for women who want to have kids, makes the 40s a different decade than for men (kind of the decade following a reckoning of sorts). (obviously, that is a generalization that pretends gender is more binary than it is.) i have been very lucky when it comes to death and disease among the people i love, and people itt who have experienced that kind of loss, i'm so sorry.

much more trivially, i find the stuff in the cultural ether about women in their 40s irritating--in my circle of female friends who live near me (all of whom are younger than me lol) there's a lot of Cathy cartoon-style bemoaning growing older, and maybe i'm just a case of arrested development, but i don't identify. i guess i'm in worse physical shape than i used to be, but duh. my late 30s and early 40s saw me become financially stable (as much as possible in this accursed economy) in a way that still feels like a bit of a trip (and was dependent on getting married, honestly, which is shitty), but i do think it's made life less stressful. on the other hand, political/global stuff is terrifying--i feel like my 40s so far have been characterized by a weird cognitive dissonance--a realization that i have become a part of the bourgeoisie, with bourgeois habits (i always had those, though, just less money), who nonetheless has been radicalized by how terribly entrenched wealth inequality and economic exploitation are in this country. i feel dread about how precarious basically everyone's life feels right now (except, like, three uber-rich people), but that doesn't seem like it's necessarily about being in my 40s, just about where the world is as i happen to be in my 40s.

also i feel like i was never particularly adventurous in my aspirations for my life, so the fact that i'm 41 and there's a pandemic, so i spend Friday nights reading in a comfortable chair is fine by me.

Question: does having kids give you a connection to the next generation and feeling younger or make you feel your age and out of touch?

Yes.

i feel like my 40s so far have been characterized by a weird cognitive dissonance--a realization that i have become a part of the bourgeoisie, with bourgeois habits (i always had those, though, just less money), who nonetheless has been radicalized by how terribly entrenched wealth inequality and economic exploitation are in this country

Ha, I feel you on this 10000%. Just giving modern life a moment's thought must push you leftward, unless you're a total fucking psychopath. And yet, I realize that I'm not really doing anything about it (except for the mitigation of environmental impact caused by not having kids vs. having them). Oh, well, at least I'm not a Bitcoin farmer, I tell myself...

I feel every bit of that, hs. More to say later at a computer.

hi horseshoe. that's a great post :)

unperson, i, too, am not doing enough about it.

io, i find what you wrote upthread about coming through your grief about the kids/partner thing and then deciding you were not willing to give yourself over to it later when it became an option very moving!

xp hi Tracer! thank you!

otm

bourgeois habits (i always had those, though, just less money)

lol and yes

booming post from horseshoe

(i am 35 so i'll see yall itt l8rz)

i love nothing more than to buy wine and snacks and physical books tbh--have been like that, except for the wine part, since i was 5 and filling out those Scholastic book orders in elementary school.

xp hi m bise!!! <3

Hi horseshoe we are the same age and I loved your post

hm it had never occurred to me to blame Scholastic for my love of physical media but you may be right

fgti, that is an immense compliment coming from you, ty!

I chime with as much of that post as could reasonably be expected horseshoe, nailed a few things there

I'm in no rush to don a flat cap, wear tweed and have a long beard like people twenty years younger than me, put it that way.

― Mark G, Monday, 22 February 2021 13:27 (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

Or older, tbf

Calz- navvies/tarries

hm it had never occurred to me to blame Scholastic for my love of physical media but you may be right

― rob, Monday, February 22, 2021 8:36 AM (eight minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

Yes, this is a revelation, the thrilling sensation of New! Books! is precisely the same all these decades later

Am 41 as well* and thank you for your post Horseshoe.

(technically I'm still and will remain 40 for a while, because just like you the rona birthdays don't really seem to count, and my second birthday-that-can't-be-celebrated is already coming up! not that I mind too much: I've my gf, and wine and books will def do <3)

there is something about "Roadman" that tickles me in a similar way that "Wheelman" as used in the world of James Ellroy style crime-fiction does! Sorry I know this doesn't make much sense and apologies for the whiff of male chauvinism.

I'm in my late 40s. I have three kids, one just turned 18 & another will turn 21 in a few months. I guess I'm the dreaded patriarch. Thanks Tracer Hand for helping me see why my son says "cap" all the time (Paris not London but he has some British friends).

It's strange moving toward the other side of the parenting thing, although I hope it's a long time still: my kids & wife are by a million miles the people I most love being with. The pandemic's been good in that way: hour-long lunches & two hour long dinners every day where we just talk & laugh together about everything: it's a dinner party every day, with the most fun & sympathetic people I can imagine.

But getting older's meant more death: my thesis director, to whom I was closer than to my own father, died just before the pandemic; another person who I'd admired for a long time & had been finally able to spend time with, died of Covid; two other people I'd clashed with for decades but were important parts of my life at various points, died in the last year. These are all boomers, in their 60s and 70s. A high school friend was killed by the cops last year, dying unmonitored in jail of the DTs. Death everywhere. My parents are still alive & I haven't seen them in almost three years, because I live across the sea & they don't want to travel anymore, & we don't have the money for us to go to see them. & with the rona who knows if we'll ever even be able to make it back there before they're gone.