cottagecore and other internet aesthetics

Old Lunch, feels a bit like you're creating a strawman here - think it's been kinda established on this thread that no one's saying you can't like the box, or that liking the box makes you a fash?

That being said, I do think a fascination for the old ways of the countryside has a specific history of association w/ reactionary and fascist movements that not "everything" does. This doesn't mean you can't like it - it just means that, as with liking I dunno black metal or something, it's worth being aware that there's some unsavoury fellow travellers.

xposts

like I agree that nothing is untainted but not everything has had actual fascist movements spring up in worship of it either, and I'm talking historically, not just some current alt right dorks

I think things can be reactionary, or “trad,” and not fascist. I don’t believe we need to be fanatical modernists in aesthetics, razing the old to make way for the new. That carries dangers of its own.

Sure, but to add to what Daniel said, if you're deliberately oblivious to the more disturbing facets of your aesthetic community, I will deem you at least somewhat suspicious.

lol what "dangers"??

the issue comes when everything nostalgic gets coded as "fash," as if the watercolors were the most important thing to know about hitler

The question for me is how far are these internet aesthetics supposed to reflect reality, along with specific ideologies and philosophies. How much real-life is supposed to be inferred by them? Is it their job to do this?

If primarily they're supposed to be treated on an ephemeral level, as a vibe or collage you can dip in-and-out of, be inspired by, like a multimedia playlist: "I wanna mash together Thomas Kinkade, Trumpton, Beethoven's 6th and The Kinks", then it's unlikely to be either a reflection of reality or a guiding philosophy; it's pure fantasy, pure aesthetics - artful inspiration to be pulled apart, recombined, messed-with etc.

That said, you can't get away from the social politics of a lot of these. From Babydoll to Laborwave, there's going to be some level of message wrapped up in them. You can't get away from that any more than you can get away from the problematic racism in classic Disney films.

actually thanks to Uline, most cardboard boxes are fascist

Mmmmmmm if fascists start promoting watercolor painting classes and propagandizing adherents with visions of a better world where watercolors are the best, most valid kind of painting and hinting that other arts are inferior and mmmmight be to blame for the non-primacy of watercolor specialists, your facile comparison would be more apt.

xp ums RIGHT ON BAN ULINE

where's the roland barthes emoji when you need it

hitler did try to destroy modernism

Sure, but to add to what Daniel said, if you're deliberately oblivious to the more disturbing facets of your aesthetic community, I will deem you at least somewhat suspicious.

trad aesthetics were part of nazism. but that doesn't mean all trad aesthetics are nazi.

i understand why people make the comparison between this stuff -- which *is* connected with a longing for "traditional" ways of life -- and fascism. but it's a step too far, using a firehose instead of scalpel.

https://i.imgur.com/bomet5e.gif

what are some "trad" aesthetics that are non-fascist? imo they are all nostalgic false narratives, what else are "traditional" ways of life other than a way of telling a romantic story that smooths out the oppression, racism, immiseration and feudalism that accompanied this way of life.

why did i ask idk

what traditional way of life does treeship long for

The bad NS had a piece a free years back about how this kind of thing had happened with architecture accounts on twitter. Might be useful for some people needing a bit more context to what some of us are saying.

is "fascist" a synonym for "reactionary" or "conservative"?

i'm not endorsing cottagecore or trad aesthetics or conservatism or being reactionary

oh yeah, see also "western civilization" lies that the right wing tells

Trad aesthetics flow from norms that were created to uphold trad values. Adopting them without queering or flexing or re-imagining them is being led down the garden path imo.

I mean, it really depends on your culture and where you are. I realize "trad" on the internet is probably coded very white (and honestly, this is all deeply unfamiliar to me because for all the time I spend on ilx I'm not very internet-connected in general), but I just spent a decade in Alaska, where when you talk about traditional ways of life you are generally talking about Alaska Native culture and rural subsistence living.

sorry Lily i can’t hear you i’m busy affixing these vintage farm implements to my wall - don’t even know what they do, really

I basically have no personal conception of an aesthetic community

Neither do I, strictly speaking, but I am aware that pagan black metal fandom, for example, is not something that occurs in a vacuum, as it loosely ties me to a community of folks with whom I have a great deal in common (we're into it for chiefly, yes, aesthetic reasons) and others who are very much unlike me, even unsettlingly so (i.e. actual ecofascists). You might retort that this concern holds true for all fandoms, and you'd be right, but I'd be lying if I said that the community of pagan black metal fans isn't generally likelier to espouse, say, remigrationist views that run counter to my very existence.

Yes Lily absolutely agree w that. I specifically said upthread that the critique of "back to the land-ism" excludes indigenous ppl who were displaced/massacred by white resettlement, whose ACTUAL practices are then adopted as roleplay in a gross erasure.

xpost I guess that's part of why I've historically tended to eschew fandoms in favor of appreciating things in my own little lonely bubble. But I recognize that I'm probably an outlier in that regard.

I think we're quibbling about semantics here. I am exactly like you, but to me that kind of relationship with art also intersects with looser conceptions of 'fandom' and 'community' (be it, to quote Bataille, 'the community of those who have no community'). Merely liking something draws you outside; it is enough to burst said lonely bubble imo.

leave me alone with my thomas kinkade paintings

In, say, the uk or ireland its possible for it to be a fairly legit trad way of life with continuous ties- thinking the islands and the west fairly specifically- a lifestyle that generations of people were forced into!

but also a bit that rich scions of mumford wealth roleplay at also in order to lecture everyone about how easy it is and how much better life would be if we all owned a cotswold listed building and got Trevor with a masters in agricultural science to do all the work for us on minimum wage

Shades of shades depending on the historical context for me anyway

nb where cores or aesthetics or fandoms come into it idk im a simple man of the islands me

I've historically tended to eschew fandoms in favor of appreciating things in my own little lonely bubble. But I recognize that I'm probably an outlier in that regard.

you're a prolific poster on a messageboard that discusses politics and pop culture so i'd say this is.... incorrect

Pfft, implying this place is endowed with even a modicum of reality.

lol, touché. To the extent that ILX counts as an aesthetic community, this would be my sole exception.

See deems the vibe in our context is less what you’re talking about and more na Sasanaigh in this infamous article, specifically

When my wife Nona and I first came here, we said west Cork is like England in the Fifties. We felt so at home here. It felt like old home, going back in time, to old England.

xpost Generally feeling pretty okay about the ethos of my fellow aesthetes in that regard, though.

How do you feel about their logos and pathos, though?

Honestly when ppl start on "the good old days" in any capacity I usually have to step out of the room on a pretext. They never mean the actual historical material conditions.

Yeah, I would think that ppl that are a part of the fairly legit trad way of life with continuous ties don't really spend much time celebrating it as an ~~internet aesthetic~~. At least the ones I know don't, they're online ofc and have instagram and etc. but don't tend to use it as a celebration of that.

Tbf rose-tinted left-wing nostalgia is also a thing.

xp

xp absolutely nailed on the people in that piece above voted Tory for their own selfish reasons, and didn’t like the results of their actions so it’s time to move back in time to somewhere they don’t have to think about any of that 🙃

what are some "trad" aesthetics that are non-fascist?

I think centering the idea of "neighborliness" e.g.

https://bedstuystrong.com/

or, similarly, fetishizing immigrant mutual aid societies or etc. is one version of this I've seen

xp this agrees with what pom said

When communities are well-knit and caring and working properly, they do mutual aid without calling it anything at all. I think about this a lot. Yes.

Yeah i hear that gyac- in specific contexts the cosplay of cottageplay feeds into a hundred things and patterns that id have thoughts on- definitely. West cork a fine example!

But also the underlying assumption on ilx isnt about the cottage lifestyles or w/e its maybe more like the attn or study or time ppl might presume everyone others would have to delve into semiotics around the culture and the language and angle that we each of us "should" have or the agreed line on these things? Thats a culture in itself imo

Tbh American settlers would never have survived without collective care/mutual aid/barn raisings/etc because mostly they were mostly not very good at farming and they were NOT highly trained frontier survivalists by and large. There's just a lot to be unpacked about this whole thing.

xp to Darragh--people posting to this thread pretending they aren't allowed to like cottages anymore certainly have time to read up.

Lol yes look im staving away from those takes too

;)

I'm also intrigued by the metonymic emphasis on 'cottage'.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it has an, um, broader semantic value in British English…

hee ive not been saying im behaving