outbreak! (ebola, sars, coronavirus, etc)

Even if she does come over to the vaxx side, Amy’s begun to question her politics. While she thought Trump was horrible, maybe, if he were still president, she’d still have her university job or be able to express her concerns more freely. After a lifetime of voting for Democrats, she’s suddenly feeling open to other candidates. “It’s kind of weird,” she said. “I sometimes wonder, well, am I really a Republican?”

And I offer up a hearty, "FUCK YOUUUUUUU" in response.

It's just selfishness. Like, maybe the vaccines are bad for you, but this pandemic isn't going to end until most people get them. So if you choose not to get them out concern for your own personal health, you are being selfish.

"buT if YoUr vACCInes wOrK so welL, WhY Do YOu CARE WHat i ChOoSe To Do?"

...says he believes in “science and medicine.” But he’s also skeptical about a vaccine he feels Big Pharma rushed to the market. Why be a guinea pig?

Literally billions of people have already gone ahead and volunteered to be the guinea pigs, so it's not like there isn't much info about the side effects of these vaccines, yet. The scientists who track the numbers have massive amounts of data. That's how the "science" that you say you believe in works. What's yer problem, moron?

He’s confident that after having COVID — well, what he suspects was COVID-19, back in January 2020 —

If you're musing whether you might actually be a Republican, you're probably already a Republican in pretty much every way that matters.

yeah, and you're being a selfish dipshit who thinks they're smarter than everyone else, so yes, you may well be a Republican.

While lying to a hostess is fairly low-risk, doing the same with your boss carries bigger consequences. When the ice-cream shop put a mandate in place, David tried to get an exemption, to no avail. He now works for a cryptocurrency firm that doesn’t require proof of vaccination, even though he goes into an office. He’s confident that after having COVID — well, what he suspects was COVID-19, back in January 2020 — he has full immunity anyway. How else to explain the fact that after going to three music festivals with thousands of people, he never tested positive?

For those of us planning our investment portfolios, it seems worth knowing that this is how good at math the people who work at cryptocurrency firms are

i have a co-worker who has happened to land a senior job in my department that i also went for, who in the last week has outed herself as booster hesitant. her train of thought seems to be “where will it end? will we just be told to get these shots every year? it feels like we’re being forced to go along with something..” and every time she voices these sentiments she makes sure to preface it with “i’m not antivax”. i have to tread softly because otherwise it would look like extreme sour grapes due to the competition aspect, but thankfully a colleague has just landed in the chat with a massive truthbomb of a post, not specifically directed at her, but kind of taking no prisoners. making the points that 1) they might not even be here if their ancestors hadn’t participated in global vaccination programs, with far more basic science behind them 2) do they refuse the vaccinations required to visit some of the loveliest places in the world?

I'm kind of with your coworker here. We were told these were the most effective vaccines ever made (and they are!). So why do we need a booster six months later? I understand that getting a booster gives ultra-super-mega-immunity, but is it necessary? Even for someone without conspiratorial tendencies, this feels like a money grab.

Personally, I think I might wait for the nasal spray vax booster, since it seems like the virus camps out in your sinuses.

Trying to keep objective.
But looking at the numbers around boosters, my main concern is that the results are being absurdly undersold.
Most people are sick of COVID, sick of being told what to do, and are thinking of boosters are a nice-to-have.
They are transformative.
(1/4) pic.twitter.com/coSDo7YtpD

— Paul Mainwood (@PaulMainwood) November 18, 2021

I don't understand the y axis on that graph. Is it saying that unvaccinated people had a 25% risk of getting delta at some point? (not saying that isn't the case or isn't plausible, just trying to understand what the starting point is).

“At some point” = during 12 months in uk

Is that right? Something like 15-25% of people tested positive for the delta variant?

no

I'm kind of with your coworker here. We were told these were the most effective vaccines ever made (and they are!). So why do we need a booster six months later? I understand that getting a booster gives ultra-super-mega-immunity, but is it necessary? Even for someone without conspiratorial tendencies, this feels like a money grab.

Personally, I think I might wait for the nasal spray vax booster, since it seems like the virus camps out in your sinuses.

Fair enough. I'll probably get one at some point. I'm also a needle-hater, which I'm convinced is a much bigger piece of hesitancy than most people want to admit.

I agree and think that, when asked, most of the needle-haters rationalize their hesitancy as something else that sounds less irrational.

^^ And that's probably part of what I'm doing here.

I mean, it's not fun to pass out in a Walgreens parking lot in the Excelsior.

we don't know if the third booster is going to be the last. there's some evidence it will be. there's no evidence it won't be.

if you live in a country where covid is as prevalant as ... well, every country on earth, but the UK is the example, and you don't get a booster, you will more likely than not catch covid within a year or two. it will likely not be a serious case. you will on average give it to about one person if you catch it.

i want to say this as kindly as possible, since none of us are experts in epidemiology or virology, but i am not 100% clear on the mental gymnastics required to completely reject expert advice, based on arguments about where the virus "camps out" (??!?!?!) or "t-cells don't wane" (still wtf at this) while at the same time being unable to read a graph.

Fair enough. I'll probably get one at some point. I'm also a needle-hater, which I'm convinced is a much bigger piece of hesitancy than most people want to admit.

― DJI, Monday, November 22, 2021 5:23 PM (five minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

this is definitely true, and tbh the #1 thing the media could have done over the last 9 months to increase the number of people vaccinated is to stop publishing photos of needles going in arms. would have saved thousands of lives.

Also, this is why a nasal spray version will be great.

It will be, once it's available. But until then, this needle-hating passer-outer is getting the vaccines and whatever boosters are recommended. Because I hate dying when I don't have to more.

i would not wait for. emergency use authorizations may not be granted given there are other options. regular authorization is typically a multi-year process.

Also, read the graph for me then, caek. WTF does the Y-axis mean, and how does that help me determine how much more the booster is going to keep me from getting hospitalized vs just sticking with my current two Moderna jabs?

Yet another reason why I wish I took statistics before quantum mechanics.

it doesn't xp.

And also also, COVID does camp out in your nasal passages.

i know. what do you believe the clinical implications of that are?

skin cancer camps out on your skin. you can't cure it with lotion.

If you have more antibodies in your nasal passages, the virus doesn't even make it past them into your lungs, is the idea.

But whatever, the current needle-based vaccines are plenty strong.

i am okay with wearing a seat belt in my car with an airbag, why not?
we need to have public schooling regarding the destigmatization of needles; people need to recognize beyond the abstract that most hypodermic experiences are not dangerous bad or generally even painful.

At least for me, it's not about education. I have a messed-up physical response to needles. I didn't even fear the Moderna shot, and barely felt it. And yet, 10 minutes later, I had to lay down on the pavement because I was about to pass out.

you're saying that's a physical thing from getting jabbed by a hypo? what's that about?

my mother also fears needles to a very high degree. some of my first memories are really lynchian fucked up things with her in abject horror, screaming about needles. she has always been against them, but they were fine for me. it is just a very emotional thing for her, going beyond that to the point where it also becomes very physical.

like the panic in her voice when she is near a needle is very alarming and hard to forget

i don't have this response to getting shots or needles but i do to other things and it's "physical" in that there is an actual response in your nervous system. i can see how that can happen even though hard to explain or understand.

that was an xp, it's not really a fear of things that you are conscious of in that respect (not like KM's mom, sounds like)

Needle phobia, pain phobia, blood phobia, snake phobia: it looks like the phobias that lower your blood pressure and make you feel faint (rather than raising your blood pressure, like most phobias) have a strong genetic component.

i have a similar reaction to the prospect of delivering a presentation

yeah and at least for me i don't have to be consciously thinking about the thing or "afraid" of it at all to bring about the vasovagal response so it's not something i could be educated out of

i look away when i get blood drawn because seeing things go into my skin can trigger it but i don't consider myself afraid of needles

I respond to overwhelming stress by getting sleepy and feeling like I may fall to the ground.

I had to get an epidural steroid shot for my horrible no-good lower back a few weeks ago and I started passing out in the middle of it and they had to lean the table over so my head was down. Total nightmare as they had needles in my spine at that point. From now on I'm asking for general anesthesia if I have to do that again.

What harbl said. I'm guessing it's a brain-based response but it feels autonomic to me.

it is autonomic iirc? that happened to me when i gave blood. i thought it was due to...having less blood, but thinking back on it maybe not. i feel like i keep saying "i'm not afraid of needles" because i'm not, but something deep within me is. it's not me!

honestly not something i considered, thanks for sharing

I didn't realize these things were so mysterious for people who really suffer from it. I don't think anything of needles but right after one of the covid shots i swear i fainted for a tenth of a second... and then was fine.

For weeks it seemed like every headline image on every news site was a needle sticking out of an arm... yeah that really couldn't have helped.

over the past two months, between blood draws and surgery and preop and acupuncture and various bullshit, i probably had something like 250 needles in me. it's not desirable exactly but i generally don't much care.

Two of my best friends have needlephobia. It outright ruins their day

usually photos and talking about things like blood etc don't do it to me, has to be irl. but one time i watched a dr. pimple popper clip on youtube and my whole world started to go dark even though i wanted to keep watching it. and i LIKE dr. pimple popper!