Better Call Saul

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idk maybe I'm the only one who got this impression but that Jesse/Kim scene still felt significant because Kim, in theory, could have talked Jesse out of hiring Saul

obviously you're right in that it didn't have to be Jesse there but this series has earned a bit of fanservice here and there. I did think it was very cool when Hank & Gomez popped up for a quick scene in BCS

frogbs, Monday, 15 August 2022 17:40 (one year ago) link

xp

"Ok, ok, I'll say it. You're the one who knocks."

mh, Monday, 15 August 2022 17:41 (one year ago) link

Literally all they had to do was have Paul turn to Kim and say - "ey. This Saul...he any good?"

Xpost lol

The scene between Walt, Jesse and Saul worked because they focused on the stepdad/stepson vibe Paul and Cranston had during that period of BB, and recaptured it nicely.

I really think it’s just that Aaron Paul is remarkably bad in the scene (& not because he doesn’t look 20, they always do that shit and it’s usually classic)

Wiggum Dorma (wins), Monday, 15 August 2022 17:47 (one year ago) link

I saw some Q&A thing with one of the show's creators (can't remember which one) where someone asks what they would've done had Odenkirk died from his heart attack, since they hadn't actually finished filming at that point. and the response was "well we'd have no choice but to cancel the season". amazing how close this whole season was to not happening at all

frogbs, Monday, 15 August 2022 18:19 (one year ago) link

Literally all they had to do was have Paul turn to Kim and say - "ey. This Saul...he any good?"

Xpost lol

― We were clothed, except for Caan, who was naked. Don't know why. (Neanderthal), Monday, 15 August 2022 17:42 (one hour ago) link

Yeah it was ruined by being too long; trying too hard to callback to Jesse's origins with Emilio.

I would totally go with your rewrite but maybe have it start with Kim pausing due to the rain, glancing over at Jesse who is already looking at her leaning against the wall. As she pulls out a cigarette to wait, she breaks the tension with the stranger looking at her with a small talk comment like the one Jesse actually used.

Kim: (gesturing) "can you believe this rain? In a desert?"

Jesse: (shrugs, then takes a few steps towards her staring into the parking lot. Stops, looks towards Sauls office and then to her) "ey let me ask you somethin. This Saul...he any good?"

Then basically Kim's last line and the jog into the rain exactly as it was done.

Evan, Monday, 15 August 2022 19:50 (one year ago) link

Just occurred to me Elaine Benes dated both Walter White and Saul Goodman. pic.twitter.com/3GkFThliUc

— Justin McGuire (@JMcGuireMLB) August 15, 2022

Montgomery Burns' Jazz (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Tuesday, 16 August 2022 00:37 (one year ago) link

Great catch, Justin McGuire. Bob Odenkirk's already warming up for Saul: "I always knew that after I became a doctor, I would dump whoever I was with and find someone better. That's the dream of becoming a doctor." (Or else he's just reprising Stevie Grant from The Larry Sanders Show.)

clemenza, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 00:41 (one year ago) link

And I think her father was more or less Mike.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkqngcYwJnU

clemenza, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 00:52 (one year ago) link

LOL I literally watched the Dr Tongue ep of Seinefeld yesterday, no way I would have noted him as the broken arm mediator guy.

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Tuesday, 16 August 2022 01:21 (one year ago) link

very excited for the next BB/BCS meta-spinoff "Rhea Seehorn Deserves an Emmy"

Western® with Bacon Flavor, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 02:41 (one year ago) link

Elaine's father was played by the notorious Lawrence Tierney, prodigious noir heavy whose career was not helped by scaring the crap outta those who initially wanted to continue working with him, on The Simpsons and Seinfeld, for inst. Also, some off-set behavior, for instance

In July 1991, during the filming of Reservoir Dogs, Tierney shot at his nephew in a drunken rage at his Hollywood apartment, and was arrested and bailed. He was released for a day from the jail to continue filming, as recounted by the film's director Quentin Tarantino in an interview. As a result, Tarantino never again worked with or hired Tierney to act in his films.[37]
Too damn bad he didn't quite make it to the BB years.

dow, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 02:53 (one year ago) link

Won't add any spoilers for those who haven't seen it yet, but---don't expect too much, esp. from the last few minutes.

dow, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 02:56 (one year ago) link

So bizarre that Kim moved a half hour from where I live. Hearing "Central Florida Legal Aid" was jarring

Worked for me. The show was never going to go for the explosive ending that BB did.

Yeah, but what he did in courtroom was soooooo out-of-character, I mean what we were recently saying about him ffs, and so well-established over so many years, with the redundant guest star scenes supposed to justify/soften us up for the last minute thing.

dow, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 03:41 (one year ago) link

One guest star def not not not redundant, however.

dow, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 03:42 (one year ago) link

Seeing Kim's leaving (and Lalo's death) as the climax of the series and the last 4 eps as denouement, I'm happy with how it all played out. I had a feeling Saul would be caught quickly in this one. They had a lot of ground to cover in this episode -- great editing job to get it all in without seeming too rushed.

WmC, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 03:56 (one year ago) link

It was out of character because he found out Kim confessed and she's the only living person whose opinion of him he gives a fuck about. I mean her cold demeanor got him upset enough to shatter a phone booth in a previous episode.

Her confession shocks him because unlike him, she had no threat of law enforcement and multiple felonies and RICO charges looming over her. Just pure conscience.

He wants be seen as a decent human being in her eyes and that means squaring up to what he did and not weaseling his way out for maybe the first time in his life. His life is already shit, he has no real friends, he'd rather go to prison for life with the one person he loves respecting him again than emerge from jail in 7 years with nothing.

And of course that's a parallel to Walt in Breaking Bad confessing to Skyler.

Marie had zero effect on him at all. If Kim never confessed, dude is on his way to negotiating for a two year sentence and rack of lamb every night.

I like happy endings--happy in context, happy compared to all the other ways it could have ended--so I liked this. Not Mad Men's finale, or The Sopranos', but for me, very satisfactory. Saul finds Jimmy--I don't find that beyond the realm of dramatic plausibility.

If I'd made a list of who might turn up in the final episode, Marie would have been 37th. So I loved the surprise of that.

clemenza, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 05:06 (one year ago) link

I expected Lalo to walk into the courtroom carrying the St Elsewhere kid's snowglobe

the point of all the flashbacks for the ep was to drive home his final courtroom appearance.

Western® with Bacon Flavor, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 05:10 (one year ago) link

Honestly, I was kind of worn down by the Jimmy-Kim relationship over time. For me, the Jimmy-Chuck relationship was the highlight of the entire run, and that came through beautifully in the flashback here.

clemenza, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 05:14 (one year ago) link

I do find it hilarious that prosecutors we're happy to finally have someone from the cartel to charge, after finding mostly dead bodies and AWOL people along the way

They set up Jimmy's about-face with the two conversations about time-machines/regrets. Not really a big deal, but if I had to point to one thing that stretched credulity a bit, it was that one of these conversations was with Mike. Through both series, Mike never seemed especially big on reflective, heart-to-heart conversations (his family excepted). In fact, his greatest moment ever for me was when Walter tried to have one just before Mike checked out. "Shut up, Walter"--death was preferable to a heart-to-heart with Walter.

clemenza, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 05:44 (one year ago) link

I said that to my mother before Mike gave his. "He doesn't like small talk"

Weltanschauung Dunston (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 16 August 2022 05:45 (one year ago) link

Walter's reaction, of course, was vintage: berate Saul about how scientifically illiterate he was.

clemenza, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 05:48 (one year ago) link

mike had the "move to alaska" conversation with jesse - yr treading

the worst part of this episode was some acting by someone that seemed like they'd seen a 30-sec emmy highlight reels of that character and decided to amp by a 10 factor.

Western® with Bacon Flavor, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 05:59 (one year ago) link

They set up Jimmy's about-face with the two conversations about time-machines/regrets


See also the 'blink and you'll miss it' paperback copy of The Time Machine sitting on Chuck's kitchen counter.

Beautiful Bean Footage Fetishist (Old Lunch), Tuesday, 16 August 2022 10:04 (one year ago) link

i liked walter's appearances in these last few eps because it showed him from an outside perspective. namely it showed him as a pompous, high-strung ass who must've been incredibly tedious to be around

comedy khadafi (voodoo chili), Tuesday, 16 August 2022 15:18 (one year ago) link

I think Mike’s sharp character radar makes him actually care about Jimmy and Jesse though, and it translates into a weary but sincere level of interest in their thoughts. Whereas Walt he read accurately right from the start, so when he can finally tell him to just stuff it, he does.

Kim, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 16:16 (one year ago) link

He definitely adopts a parental concern with both Jesse and Ignacio (and a little bit with Kim, when he warns her about Lalo)--I'd extend the family exception to those two. And Walter, yeah, he has no use for him at all.

I'd put Jimmy/Saul maybe halfway on that spectrum?

clemenza, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 16:20 (one year ago) link

NOW HIRING: General Manager in Omaha, Nebraska https://t.co/3OnH52qsly

— Cinnabon (@Cinnabon) August 16, 2022

frogbs, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 16:21 (one year ago) link

Part of me was looking for a final heel turn at the end - throwing Kim under the bus for a couple less years in jail - but this ending was a bit less nihilistic. This half of the season felt a little like a rollercoaster. After setting up Jimmy/Saul as a complex character for the whole series, with understandable reactions to situations, they seemed to want to remind us is capital letters: JIMMY IS A POS. But then that was just used to set up the last-minute change of heart by Jimmy in the finale. It's ok, but speaks to the writers' seat-of-the-pants plotting.

DJI, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 16:53 (one year ago) link

It was a roller coaster, and a little hard for me to follow, especially the stuff connecting to BB, which I haven't seen in years. But there was a lot to wrap up, in multiple timelines, plus the opportunity to bring in popular characters again, so they forced themselves into this situation. Personally I was pretty satisfied with how it unfolded, but I think the Walter and Jesse cameos this season kinda distracted more than helped. Marie's was good

Vinnie, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 17:15 (one year ago) link

Would have liked it better if he went off to do his reduced time (but I think it would have been at least a decade: Feds seem less likely to cave quite so far, although I've read about it happening on State and lower levels pretty often), and we last see him as a jailhouse lawyer, cocky but keeping an eye about, always wondering if he's gonna get shanked or shived, since, as he mentions to prosecutors, some of those guys he was afraid of are still out there). That seems a lot more realistic/in character than---what they did, ugghhh

dow, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 17:17 (one year ago) link

Was waiting for Bill to plead with Jimmy one more time and Jimmy responding "you're one of the smartest guys I ever met, but you're too stupid to see I made up my mind ten minutes ago"

Weltanschauung Dunston (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 16 August 2022 17:19 (one year ago) link

Xpost Jimmy is way safer on the inside than he is on the outside now that everyone knows he's alive and where he lives. 7 years, 86....tomato

Weltanschauung Dunston (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 16 August 2022 17:20 (one year ago) link

I did think the Walt bit was perfectly written and delivered. Disappointed that Odenkirk and Esposito are getting their own shows next year, but not Seehorn. Maybe she'll turn up on those, along with other BCS and/or BB actors. Maybe she'll get a one-of; maybe lifer jailhouse lawyer will! They could be in one one-off together, of course.

dow, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 17:22 (one year ago) link

So is he now going off to prison in the Southwest? Everybody in that bus seems to know who Saul is.

dow, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 17:25 (one year ago) link

yeah it was the particularly unpleasant prison he mentioned during his negotiation. a bunch of his abq-based clients end up there

comedy khadafi (voodoo chili), Tuesday, 16 August 2022 17:36 (one year ago) link

Yeah, I *think* that he was genuine in not wanting to go to that prison, but I also wondered if it was his backup plan to get sent there punitively in case the deal somehow got botched or, as happened, he decided to torpedo it.

He's forever Saul Goodman there!

mh, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 17:46 (one year ago) link

The Cinnabon call from jail was one of the more surprising moments. Something we might have assumed would be one of the last things on his mind, but revealed a basic good conscience? It kept me hanging on to some hope, even as it looked like he really might go all the way down. The complexity of the happy ending they gave us feels pretty satisfying.

Kim, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 17:55 (one year ago) link

but also... who else was there to possibly call?

maf you one two (maffew12), Tuesday, 16 August 2022 18:07 (one year ago) link

It hadn't occurred to me before how uniquely suited to prison Jimmy is for someone who'd never done time. To whatever extent he isn't able to trade in on his rep as a criminal-friendly lawyer, he also has his rep as a high-rolling cartel associate. And he just generally seems to have a lot of facility in dealing with the type of people who might be doing hard time (and in ducking trouble if it comes his way). They could probably whip up a fun little miniseries showing him ruling the jailbird roost ten years down the line.

Beautiful Bean Footage Fetishist (Old Lunch), Tuesday, 16 August 2022 18:16 (one year ago) link

yeah that's why his change of heart didn't bother me - everything in his life is gone. he has no more family, no more friends, he's never gonna practice law again, and he'll never recover any of the riches he had without falling into the same habits that lost him everything in the first place. the only thing he has is Kim, and by confessing to the Howard thing it pretty much confirms that things there could never go back to the way they were. so what's he got to live for? at least in prison he's in a place where people know and respect him.

frogbs, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 18:31 (one year ago) link

The Cinnabon call...revealed a basic good conscience?

Good conscience, I'd say, and also a dynamic--I've experienced this more than once, I'm sure others have too--whereby you develop a kind reflexive loyalty not to the company you work for, you know you're essentially nothing to them, but to the people you work with. You don't want to leave them with a mess. There's some guilt there, too, or something.

clemenza, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 18:34 (one year ago) link

"a kind of"

clemenza, Tuesday, 16 August 2022 18:34 (one year ago) link


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