Is the Guardian worse than it used to be?

Mind you GG, wtf are you going on about in Stroud, the majority is 3,840, do you know the difference between votes polled by the winning candidate and the actual margin of victory or?

General election 2019: Stroud[24][25]
Party Candidate Votes % ±%
Conservative Siobhan Baillie 31,582 47.9 +2.0
Labour Co-op David Drew 27,742 42.1 -4.9
Green Molly Scott Cato 4,954 7.5 +5.3
Brexit Party Desi Latimer 1,085 1.6 New
Libertarian Glenville Gogerly 567 0.9 New

Majority 3,840 5.8 N/A
Turnout. 65,930 78.0 +1.0
Registered electors 84,536 +2.0
Conservative gain from Labour Co-op Swing +3.5
General

stand down Glenville Gogerly for the good of the nation

George Galloway feeling his ears burning

Need to stop buying these hats from my dodgy mate, he thinks

the people who oppose the "squeaking" - a highly patronising term - are extremely bad (like, ludicrously so) at articulating at why they think this view is incorrect.

i think this view is incorrect because i lived thru the Labour governments under Blair who had an enormous majority to reverse the Thatcherite economic settlement. and the current PLP is if anything more neolib than they were

also because i'm an ideological purist i refuse to vote for a party that has been outed as being institutionally racist and harbours vicious terfs as MPs

Can we not have *both*, libcom.org Twitter poster?

― Grandpont Genie, Friday, 21 October 2022 bookmarkflaglink

A general election will not sort anything. There is no magic bullet answer to our problems. A Lab right government won't even begin xps

also because there is no mechanism for people who want Sevco Labour to offer policies that address inequality, poverty and authoritarianism to influence this so how will voting them into power change that situation?

not me grumbling that "sevco" is even more arcane and hard to parse than "underpants gnomes"

don't worry this is the second grandad!! point i've earned today, after not knowing why my pals in another place were talking abt graham "dua lipa" brady

i'll let myself out

Forget purism, let's play the 'pragmatic' card. Inflation at 10%, public finances in disarray, energy costs to be high for this winter and the next. Interests rates on the up meaning mortgage defaults. NHS and rail companies not working. Possible climate events.

Do we know what Labour are going to do about any of this? Even before throwing trans rights and migrants under the bus xps

i know it's a bit arcane i just got tired of writing Nu or using air quotes around Labour

Mind you GG, wtf are you going on about in Stroud, the majority is 3,840, do you know the difference between votes polled by the winning candidate and the actual margin of victory or?

You were the one that brought up Stroud, gyac, so I looked up the election result from 2019. Of course my calculation was crude and unscientific! We can't possibly *know* that the lack of a Green candidate on the ticket would bring about a Labour victory, as some of the Green voters may have got the huff and stayed home, or whatever. I was merely articulating that a coalition of non-Tory parties standing aside for each other to get the Tory out makes that outcome more likely.

I did actually know that Sevco was a reference to the former owners of Scottish football club Rangers, it's only when people start claiming obscure internet references are worthy of the name "memes" that my hackles are raised!

I want an election because I just think they're neat.

certainly neater than any of the alternatives, including the status quo, that I could think of.

lads there's a new snrub in town

thanks now i'm singing the Eagles to myself

(nb the Eagles are ok)

I mean just imagine rioting, actually facing off police brutality, going to court or jail just so for the chance you could elect Starmer.

I'm rioting for Reeves!

in fact the difference here is the prospect of Chancellor Reeves actually fills me with more dread than Hunt

certainly neater than any of the alternatives, including the status quo, that I could think of.

― Grandpont Genie, Friday, 21 October 2022 bookmarkflaglink

Just a complete inability to face reality.

*I* do??? Christ. Look, instead of constantly chewing me out, which is become extremely tiring, I want to know what YOU propose to be the best solution to resolve the current mess we are in, coz I am not seeing a lot of communication coming from your direction right now.

_Mind you GG, wtf are you going on about in Stroud, the majority is 3,840, do you know the difference between votes polled by the winning candidate and the actual margin of victory or?
_
You were the one that brought up Stroud, gyac, so I looked up the election result from 2019. Of course my calculation was crude and unscientific! We can't possibly *know* that the lack of a Green candidate on the ticket would bring about a Labour victory, as some of the Green voters may have got the huff and stayed home, or whatever. I was merely articulating that a coalition of non-Tory parties standing aside for each other to get the Tory out makes that outcome more lik

More incoherent rambling I accidentally cut out and can’t be fucked reinstating

Mark s, you must be seeing a better side to this guy than his endless bedshitting is demonstrating

pot kettle black, gyac. I don't believe it is a complete misreading.

I personally love to sneer from my centrist high horse and direct disdain at people who are directly affected by bad Labour policies “What do you think is better?” as though the message that a party can treat you with contempt and openly pass laws to hurt you and people like you is a good one for democracy.

pot kettle black, gyac. I don't believe it is a complete misreading.

not me grumbling that "sevco" is even more arcane and hard to parse than "underpants gnomes"

Sevco is a football reference, worse still it's a Scottish football reference.

*I* do??? Christ. Look, instead of constantly chewing me out, which is become extremely tiring, I want to know what YOU propose to be the best solution to resolve the current mess we are in, coz I am not seeing a lot of communication coming from your direction right now.

― Grandpont Genie, Friday, 21 October 2022 bookmarkflaglink

Look I'm not going to risk losing a limb for that cunt. I know what I don't want. If you want to do then be my guest.

I don't have the answers and you don't have to pretend you do. It's ok, these are terrible times.

Yeah GG you quoted the total number of votes and then said that was the margin of victory. That was a complete misreading - which had the effect of making your argument seem like a lot more of a slam dunk than it was. It’s not a big deal but I mean…!

A bigger deal - and you get this a lot in the US Pol threads - is the idea that once the ostensibly centre-left party is in power they will unleash some kind of progressive programme that they’d been keeping quiet about. It’s much more likely that they mean what they say, and they’re either not saying much or they’re attempting to outflank the Tories on the right over, say, immigration.

Look at what's in front of you. He hasn't supported the nurses striking, and they aren't the most militant lot. Even Biden actually pretended to have a programme!

And when elected he's done next to nothing! He's giving crumbs rn and praying!!!

at least biden is going to nuke the uk p soon

An ignominious end for Great British Power

What does any of this have to do with the Graun?

the goblins are out of the box and hurtling across the entire board

Putin will steal the election next week he'll have no choice xxxp

Boris is Zelensky's candidate, who is Vlad's?

also boris

russia-ukraine accords reached when they realise they agree on this and build from there: UK fucked, world cheers, biden nukes us

Apologies to anyone who has been offended the "charmlessness" of this particular Goblin, esp the meritorious gyac.

It is connected with the Graun, Matt#2, as the Graun still believes Starmer can deliver, or does at least some of the time.

I don't pretend to have the answers. I think that maybe I look to eloquent people on here for answers because I make the basic mistake of assuming - not logical or rational, but easy to do in the spur of the moment - that being well-read and able to write well about politics equates with having alternative solutions to hand that the individuals would implement if they had the means to do so.

Doesn't mean that they, or I, for that matter, shouldn't speculate on the best ways out of the mess, even if they seem far away, i.e.

- Challenger to Starmer emerges, more aligned with Corbyn politically, but able to exploit optics more than him to win over centrist sceptics. Corbyn's ideas with Blair's slick presentation, if you will, who challenges KS for leadership. Thought maybe Burnham may be that person (tho Calz, whom I trust, doesn't rate him and may have good reasons for not doing so-- AB seems to have done a good job as mayor of MCR, maybe people living there would say different).

- Left leaning PLP members (such as there are, maybe Sultana, Whittome?) bin Labour for good, reach out to unions for support, including those currently unaffiliated with the effete TUC, to form a new party to the left of Labour, take some (many?) members of the Labour membership with them.

Other (please suggest).

the mass assault on Corbyn from the media wasn't because his optics were bad - they would treat Blair himself the same way if he suggested mild economic reforms, and likely with a similar outcome

Kieth's entire project since taking charge of - ok i won't say it - has been to ensure that the mechanisms of that party are permanently closed to anybody who wants to challenge any aspect of neolib orthodoxy or flagshagging. it's Zombie Labour ok that's less arcane i guess.

there is NO HOPE FOR CHANGE thru the current parliamentary system and no hope of anybody winning power who wants to change that system

sorry if this seems bleak, that's because things are very bleak. viewers in Scotland and Northern Ireland have alternative programming

tbf if people want to riot to try and change that, i'm in. a GE isn't that

goblins 4 spümcø labour

GG i dont think of you as a goblin

we are not the same

sorry i kinda skipped over the possibility of a Zarah party. that would be better than any of the alternatives, it's not a short term project, and the SCG have shown a frankly masochistic willingness to chunter under their breath, do nothing and let themselves get picked off one by one

oh and this is all the Graun thread because this is their dream Labour except not enough virulent transphobia

sorry, SCG?

Socialist Campaign Group

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialist_Campaign_Group

(xpost)