Pazz and Jop.

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Ragged Glory topping the list makes sense to me as it was the consolidation of his comeback the previous year with Freedom.

Didn't Xgau have some sort of temporary break with Marcus over the Public Enemy and the Terrodome controversy?

The appeal of Little Creatures eludes me beyond the singles, but looking at the entire P&J list for 1985 it was a fairly dismal year and a distinct comedown from 1984. I mean, Mellencamp and Fogerty in the Top Ten? (New Day Rising would have been my pick).

gjoon1, Sunday, 1 October 2023 02:51 (six months ago) link

Hounds of Love? Tim? Steve McQueen? Up on the Sun? Promise? Lots of good stuff that year.

Beyond Goo and Evol (President Keyes), Sunday, 1 October 2023 03:21 (six months ago) link

Fables of the Reconstruction…

Chavez video on MTV, July 1995 (morrisp), Sunday, 1 October 2023 03:24 (six months ago) link

I’ve always been surprised at how underrated Ragged Glory was until the last couple years when it’s finally started to get its due…glad to see that it got its due somewhere at least. I was too young in ‘90 to know how it was received at the top but I do know that by the late 90s-00s it wasn’t really a Neil release that anyone had much to say about.

zacata, Sunday, 1 October 2023 03:25 (six months ago) link

And of course that should say “at the time” rather than “at the top”.

zacata, Sunday, 1 October 2023 03:25 (six months ago) link

Huh. I felt like it was solidified as the last truly great Neil album even back in the 90s.

Beyond Goo and Evol (President Keyes), Sunday, 1 October 2023 03:34 (six months ago) link

NME's 1985 albums list https://www.nme.com/features/1985-2-1045389

Two 1960s recordings in the top ten, as I'm not the first to point out. But other than Mad Not Mad and So Many Rivers (and what drastic exceptions those are) the rest of the top ten remains stealthily canon.

you can see me from westbury white horse, Sunday, 1 October 2023 03:44 (six months ago) link

This Neil Young conversation feels like it's taking place in an alternate dimension. Ragged Glory is pretty much the last Neil Young album people unanimously agree on. (Maybe Harvest Moon.) The tour was a huge success, it earned him an entirely new audience/reputation when he brought out Sonic Youth as his opening act... it was a whole Thing. Did he diminish its impact by releasing 75 albums in the years since? Maybe, but every time he puts out a Crazy Horse record it gets compared to Ragged Glory, so how anyone could see it as anything but a major, major part of his discography is beyond me.

read-only (unperson), Sunday, 1 October 2023 03:46 (six months ago) link

Didn't Xgau have some sort of temporary break with Marcus over the Public Enemy and the Terrodome controversy?

He did, yes--more Marcus, I think--but long since resolved.

clemenza, Sunday, 1 October 2023 03:51 (six months ago) link

Ragged Glory now has its title now expanded to Smell The Horse and its body expanded by three bonus tracks--the one I've heard is very fine---but so far this edition only available in a box set, alongside standard reissues (no other bonus tracks in there, apparently).

dow, Sunday, 1 October 2023 04:19 (six months ago) link

Little Creatures is amazing but there probably is that sense of “Amazing conversation-driving band releases another very good album at the height of their fame” that pushed the scales that don’t make as much sense in hindsight

kirsten gilla band (Whiney G. Weingarten), Sunday, 1 October 2023 04:25 (six months ago) link

See also Imperial Bedroom, To Bring You My Love,Speakerboxxx/Love Below, Late Registration, Dear Science…

kirsten gilla band (Whiney G. Weingarten), Sunday, 1 October 2023 04:29 (six months ago) link

(I almost mentioned Speakerboxx, whose status I think has diminished over time, but no I can't imagine (back whenever this was, 2010?) I was surprised to see it topped P&J, not least because I was barely aware of them pre-Stankonia at that point.)

you can see me from westbury white horse, Sunday, 1 October 2023 04:32 (six months ago) link

(Sorry for making the cardinal sin of ignoring the superior disc there.)

you can see me from westbury white horse, Sunday, 1 October 2023 04:33 (six months ago) link

I like all of those albums - regardless of whether they deserved the top spot, they're all touched with greatness and I'd say most of them are great. Even "Tennessee" is unimpeachable IMHO, a towering single on Arrest Development's fine debut, even though parts of the album gets too on the nose for my taste.

FWIW, I understand certain albums aren't heard about often except by those who were there at the time, but I've never bought into that as a failing of the work itself. It may be a reflection of evolving trends in the culture, and I get how that's a big part of the discourse surrounding pop music, but a great album is still a great album no matter how overlooked it may have become.

birdistheword, Sunday, 1 October 2023 06:05 (six months ago) link

*Arrested

birdistheword, Sunday, 1 October 2023 06:06 (six months ago) link

If Wiki is to be believed 3 Years, 5 Months and 2 Days in the Life Of... also topped the Wire's critic poll for that year.

Reeves Gabrels' Funko Pop (majorairbro), Sunday, 1 October 2023 09:35 (six months ago) link

Mellencamp's The Lonesome Jubilee is good and belongs in the top twenty.

hat trick of trashiness (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 1 October 2023 12:31 (six months ago) link

er, Scarecrow, that is. But TLJ too!

hat trick of trashiness (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 1 October 2023 12:31 (six months ago) link

Yeah. And like Ta-Nehisi Coates said about the American Civil War: "Don't say you know what you would have done. You don't know."

dow, Sunday, 1 October 2023 16:27 (six months ago) link

Ragged Glory is definitely one of Neil's true classics, Freedom was the comeback but Ragged Glory had this primal facemelting guitar sound and just a load of great tunes. it was actually the first Neil Young record i ever heard and loved it immediately.

omar little, Sunday, 1 October 2023 16:40 (six months ago) link

Chuck Klosterman wrote an article about how future generations would balk at seeing the Tune-Yards album listed at number 1 in this poll. That prophesied day has now arrived.

Halfway there but for you, Sunday, 1 October 2023 16:42 (six months ago) link

Per Ragged Glory, here's 1990 (as hell, with a lot of strong stuff, which may also incl. ones that seem a bit startling in the nether regions, but that's good in principle, just going for personal faves dammit, never mind the prevailing winds)

This poll compiles ballots from 289 critics, who divided 100 points among 10 1990 albums. Points determined placement, with total mentions (indicated in parentheses) used for tie-breaking. Maximum per album: 30. Minimum: 5.

*Includes 1989 votes: Queen Latifah 173 (18), 3rd Bass 77 (9), Faith No More 67 (5)

1. Neil Young: Ragged Glory (Reprise) 1282 (104)
2. Sinéad O'Connor: I Do Not Want What I Haven't Got (Chrysalis) 1070 (87)
3. Public Enemy: Fear of a Black Planet (Def Jam) 1026 (82)
4. Sonic Youth: Goo (DGC) 659 (63)
5. Living Colour: Time's Up (Epic) 606 (51)
6. Ice Cube: AmeriKKKa's Most Wanted (Priority) 533 (45)
7. Paul Simon: The Rhythm of the Saints (Warner Bros.) 486 (42)
8. Rosanne Cash: Interiors (Columbia) 461 (42)
9. L.L. Cool J: Mama Said Knock You Out (Def Jam) 457 (40)
10. Prince: Graffiti Bridge (Paisley Park) 417 (43)
11. Replacements: All Shook Down (Sire/Reprise) 366 (36)
12. The Chills: Submarine Bells (Slash/Warner Bros.)349 (25)
13. Deee-Lite: World Clique (Elektra) 327 (36)
14. Queen Latifah: All Hail the Queen (Tommy Boy) 278 (29) *
15. World Party: Goodbye Jumbo (Chrysalis) 259 (23)
16. Red Hot and Blue (Chrysalis) 255 (23)
17. Lou Reed/John Cale: Songs for Drella (Sire/Warner Bros.)249 (24)
18. A Tribe Called Quest: People's Instinctive Travels and the Paths of Rhythm (Jive)
247 (27)
19. Yo La Tengo: Fakebook (Restless/Bar/None) 242 (25)
20. Digital Underground: Sex Packets (Tommy Boy) 229 (27)
21. Los Lobos: The Neighborhood (Slash/Warner Bros.)234 (23)
22. Lisa Stansfield: Affection (Arista) 218 (22)
23. The Carl Stalling Project (Warner Bros.) 202 (22)
24. Jane's Addiction: Ritual de lo Habitual (Warner Bros.) 198 (19)
25. Youssou N'Dour: Set (Virgin) 188 (20)
26. Iggy Pop: Brick by Brick (Virgin) 188 (19)
27. Faith No More: The Real Thing (Slash/Warner Bros.)186 (14) *
28. Van Morrison: Enlightenment (Mercury) 182 (18)
29. Pixies: Bossanova (4AD/Elektra) 168 (18)
30. The Neville Brothers: Brother's Keeper (A&M) 164 (17)
31. The Black Crowes: Shake Your Money Maker (Def American) 160 (14)
32. Robin Holcomb: Robin Holcomb (Elektra Musician) 159 (11)
33. 3rd Bass: The Cactus Album (Def Jam) 150 (16) *
34. Guy: The Future (MCA) 149 (15)
35. Pet Shop Boys: Behaviour (EMI) 141 (13)
36. Was (Not Was): Are You Okay? (Chrysalis) 139 (17)
37. Texas Tornados: Texas Tornados (Reprise) 139 (14)
38. Eno/Cale: Wrong Way Up (Opal/Warner Bros.) 138 (16)
39. Bob Dylan: Under the Red Sky (Columbia) 133 (10)
40. Midnight Oil: Blue Sky Mining (Columbia) 129 (13)

dow, Sunday, 1 October 2023 17:10 (six months ago) link

On the same page: Singles, EPs, Reissues, Videos:
https://www.robertchristgau.com/xg/pnj/pjres90.php

dow, Sunday, 1 October 2023 17:13 (six months ago) link

Man those Prince and Replacements albums really riding on goodwill. (They're both OK, but not top 10 or 11.)

I love World Party being at 15.

you can see me from westbury white horse, Sunday, 1 October 2023 17:26 (six months ago) link

Don't remember or haven't heard some of these, but think my Top Ten would have incl. (def the first two):

Red Hot and Blue
The Chills: Submarine Bells
Neil Young: Ragged Glory
Sinéad O'Connor: I Do Not Want What I Haven't Got (87)
Public Enemy: Fear of a Black Planet

And maybe:
Texas Tornados: Texas Tornados (Reprise)
Eno/Cale: Wrong Way Up (Opal/Warner Bros.)
Bob Dylan: Under the Red Sky

among others I'd have to hear again.

dow, Sunday, 1 October 2023 17:33 (six months ago) link

My absent favourites of 1990: Chill Out, Armed Audio Warfare, Listen Without Prejudice, Rebel Music, Mixed Up, Let Them Eat Bingo, Boomania, Jordan, En-Tact, Cure for Sanity, Song (It's Immaterial), City: Works of Fiction, Pills n Thrills, Skellington

(To state the obvious, most of these weren't ever likely to be troubling P&J. Half of them were unlikely to be troubling UK lists either. And some weren't released in the US.)

you can see me from westbury white horse, Sunday, 1 October 2023 18:38 (six months ago) link

Albums I actually owned:

1. Neil Young: Ragged Glory (Reprise) 1282 (104)
2. Sinéad O'Connor: I Do Not Want What I Haven't Got (Chrysalis) 1070 (87)
3. Public Enemy: Fear of a Black Planet (Def Jam) 1026 (82)
4. Sonic Youth: Goo (DGC) 659 (63)
5. Living Colour: Time's Up (Epic) 606 (51)
6. Ice Cube: AmeriKKKa's Most Wanted (Priority) 533 (45)
10. Prince: Graffiti Bridge (Paisley Park) 417 (43)
14. Queen Latifah: All Hail the Queen (Tommy Boy) 278 (29) *
17. Lou Reed/John Cale: Songs for Drella (Sire/Warner Bros.)249 (24)
18. A Tribe Called Quest: People's Instinctive Travels and the Paths of Rhythm (Jive)
247 (27)
20. Digital Underground: Sex Packets (Tommy Boy) 229 (27)
23. The Carl Stalling Project (Warner Bros.) 202 (22)
24. Jane's Addiction: Ritual de lo Habitual (Warner Bros.) 198 (19)
33. 3rd Bass: The Cactus Album (Def Jam) 150 (16) *

Albums I did not own, but heard:

7. Paul Simon: The Rhythm of the Saints (Warner Bros.) 486 (42)
9. L.L. Cool J: Mama Said Knock You Out (Def Jam) 457 (40)
13. Deee-Lite: World Clique (Elektra) 327 (36)
26. Iggy Pop: Brick by Brick (Virgin) 188 (19)
27. Faith No More: The Real Thing (Slash/Warner Bros.)186 (14) *
31. The Black Crowes: Shake Your Money Maker (Def American) 160 (14)
35. Pet Shop Boys: Behaviour (EMI) 141 (13)

If I'd been voting back then my top 5 would probably have been (based on actual time spent listening) Ice Cube, Public Enemy, Jane's Addiction, Living Colour, Neil Young.

Absent favorites:

Suicidal Tendencies - Lights, Camera, Revolution
Ministry - The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste
Tad - Salt Lick

read-only (unperson), Sunday, 1 October 2023 19:15 (six months ago) link

I was about 15 in 1990 and remember Ragged Glory as a Big Deal in the boomer press: Freedom as the solid comeback, this the culmination.

hat trick of trashiness (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 1 October 2023 19:23 (six months ago) link

I was 14 and in my transitionary period between Def Leppard and Nirvana. Looking at that list, I only remember listening to lots of Public Enemy, Living Colour, LL Cool J, ATCQ, Digital Underground and Faith No More.

alpine static, Monday, 2 October 2023 01:29 (six months ago) link


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