Donald Trump: Classic or Dud?

I swear I misread "Testify truthfully" and "Testify tearfully"

so they started off last month with a shortlist of 900 potential jurors. I was thinking how many of these can be jury candidates who are genuinely impartial and unopinionated on this case - there will be some recusals and perhaps some dishonesty. I imagine the screening process for such a big case will be putting these mofos under a microscope, the FBI probably already have everything they've ever posted!

What exactly is the point of a jury system where the jurors are hand-picked by the legal teams? Hardly a cross-section of 'peers'. Maybe they should use all 900 and let them fight it out in a vast jury room a la A Matter of Life and Death.

As I understand it, it's not that they are hand-picked, per se, but that lawyers have a certain number of "vetoes," and have to do so strategically. (Lawyers, is this right?) Like, lawyers can't just say "no" to every juror, forever, especially when everyone knows the defendant and their alleged crimes.

makes me think of the OJ case. which infamously returned the wrong verdict

I like how this guy is starting to increasingly rely on 'look over there!' responses, per WaPo:

Steve Sadow, lead counsel for Trump in the Georgia case, pointed to the prosecution’s willingness to dismiss Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations charges, commonly known as RICO, as evidence of what he indicated was Willis’s true strategy.

“For the fourth time, Fani Willis and her prosecution team have dismissed the RICO charge in return for a plea to probation,” he said. “What that shows is this so-called RICO case is nothing more than a bargaining chip for DA Willis. Moreover, this plea was to a completely separate charge, not a part of the original indictment, which doesn’t even mention President Trump.”

I also turn on the waterworks when I plead guilty to making bad posts

Steve Saddo

“What that shows is this so-called RICO case is nothing more than a bargaining chip for DA Willis."

Congratulations for understanding how the U.S. justice system works.

Cohen testified about the statement of financial condition: "I was tasked by Mr. Trump to increase the total assets based upon a number that he arbitrarily elected, and my responsibility, along with Allen Weisselberg, predominantly, was to reverse engineer...

— erica orden (@eorden) October 24, 2023

...the various different asset classes, increase those assets in order to achieve the number that Mr. Trump had tasked us."

As Cohen testified, Trump shook his head, looking red in the face.

— erica orden (@eorden) October 24, 2023

Cohen is a bit of a dickhead but has a fantastic Noo Yawk accent. Bad move by Trump to make an enemy of someone who was involved with this particular financial fraud and has the receipts.

Trump has been doing this kind of stuff for so long it may be inconceivable to him that there's any other way to do things. He would probably also say that everybody does it, which is almost certainly true! And he woulda got away with it if it weren't for those pesky kids getting elected president and trying to overthrow an election.

I have no doubt it's a wide spread practice. Maybe the cost of investigating is just too high, but they really should be prosecuting more of these.

one thing the trump story has demonstrated or at least strong suggested is that white collar crime is wide spread and only lightly policed

It's so brazen I'd suggest it's also only lightly polished.

If Trump had friends I bet he'd be invoking the "all my friends are doing it!" defense.

if theres no one watching theres no reason to do a good job

sometimes during a witch hunt, you catch actual witches

He's never actually denied being a witch.

it's defrauding the market and can have a negative impact on ordinary folk who want to borrow from banks themselves. But I think most of the public don't really care that much about it and dismiss it as one the lesser crimes that rich people do. Obv this is just based on a feeling and not quoting any solid opinion polling. But possibly it would prosecuted more if there was more public outrage.

pretty sure theres a high public disapproval of rich people getting away with stuff

I heard a good analogy: you secretly 'borrow' $100 from your boss on a Friday, go to a casino on Saturday and win $1000, then replace the $100 monday morning

Not only did you steal the $100 from your employers, you also stole the other $900 since you couldn't have won it without the first theft

witch hunt

In Trump's case, more like a lil' bitch hunt.

well right now it's more of a snitch hunt

xxp
yeah, I'm probably posting bollox here! But it's kind of boring fraud, like maybe the public get more animated when there are lurid tales of gold bars hidden in the wardrobe or whatever.

it's a miracle he got any work done with all those criminals around him

im sure they would, and that dynamic is illustrative of the corrupt nature of the system altogether, if the people get fired up you can throw them a bone then continue on as per usual xp

it's kind of boring fraud

This is part of the challenge for sure. Like I had a generally well-informed friend saying he just can't get interested in the SBF case because anything to do with crypto just makes his eyes glaze over — a sane reaction, but actually it's been a very entertaining trial imo once you get past the gobbledygook.

the sbf trial is so crazy and funny if you dont like that you dont like financial crimes

is there anyone recommendable doing interesting coverage of the sbf case?

crypto is basically a way to do crimes that are way too stupid to get off the ground in the normal financial system, you gotta love it

is there anyone recommendable doing interesting coverage of the sbf case?

― vodkaitamin effrtvescent (calzino), Tuesday, October 24, 2023 1:54 PM (five seconds ago) bookmarkflaglink

these guys are prob deeper into the case and the whole scene than anyone

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvy1IJyax6E

matt levine also frequently writes about it https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2023-10-12/ftx-had-many-bad-spreadsheets

thanks, I needed a new wormhole to go down!

enjoy, its good stuff lol

the whole lewis take of "but wait-- the money isn't necessarily even gone because ~accounting~, there's a good chance many victims will be made whole" at that point my eyes don't glaze over but just refuse to look there because fuck these guys

lewis is really not covering himself in glory recently, which is a shame hes such a good writer, the government has throughly demonstrated that the money is in fact gone, not all of it but prob like half, also even if the money was all there the ftx brass were simply doing crimes left and right

apparently one of the investments sbf made with ftx customer funds did well and sbfs lawyers were like hey look at this that moneys not stolen its right here in fact it grew and can cover for some of the other stolen money and the judge said if i steal a dollar from you and buy a scratch ticket that hits and then pay you back i have still stolen a dollar from you (exactly the same point andy was making upthread re trump)

As I understand it, it's not that they are hand-picked, per se, but that lawyers have a certain number of "vetoes," and have to do so strategically. (Lawyers, is this right?) Like, lawyers can't just say "no" to every juror, forever, especially when everyone knows the defendant and their alleged crimes.

― Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, October 24, 2023 7:41 AM bookmarkflaglink

During the jury selection process I believe each side can excuse (veto) an unlimited number of jurors for cause ("cause" including displaying bias - there can be a side bar with the judge to argue this) and a set number of peremptory challenges (challenges where you don't have to provide an explanation).

However, there is case law prohibiting using peremptory challenges solely for racial reasons or in a way that is otherwise biased (Batson v. Kentucky being one of these cases.)

So a jury is not exactly hand-picked but it's not also completely uncurated.

felicity otm.

I see that a third lawyer in the Georgia case, Jenna Ellis, has now flipped.

Rats, ship, etc.

having to smell two of Giuliani's close range farts at a hearing should have been enough to break her

I hear that people are now starting to say that Mr. Trump may not be permitted infinite wriggles in the direction of 'out'.

how many farts must a man crack out

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution had a pretty interesting profile on Chesebro this past Sunday. People who know him well (e.g., his law school classmates at Hahvahd) are astonished at what appears to be a complete right turn in his life. Again, I am amazed at the power of Trump's only true talent: getting people to destroy themselves for his own aggrandizement.

Among the gazillions of reasons for concern about another Trump presidency is what kinds of people are still willing to go anywhere near him. The "adults in the room" of the first term, such as they were, did actually stop him from doing a lot of crazy shit. If he somehow gets thru all of this and ends up as president, it's going to be nothing but grifters, goons and Stephen Miller.

And he may never leave office voluntarily.

I hear that people are now starting to say that Mr. Trump may be permitted infinite isolations in the direction of 'increasingly.'

Keep 'em coming

“Obviously we didn’t win.”

ABC EXCLUSIVE — Mark Meadows has testified before a grand jury in exchange for immunity - according to sources familiar with the former chief of staff’s conversations with the Special Counsel.

Meadows told prosecutors he he agreed the 2020 election…

— Jonathan Karl (@jonkarl) October 24, 2023

Neanderthal

how many farts must a man crack out

The answer, my friend, is breaking in the wind

maybe the public get more animated when there are lurid tales of gold bars hidden in the wardrobe or whatever.

or nuclear secrets in the shitter

how many farts must a man crack out

what makes a man shart liars?

He’s got a lot on his mind right now, including holiday cakes:

I don’t think Mark Meadows would lie about the Rigged and Stollen 2020 Presidential Election merely for getting IMMUNITY against Prosecution (PERSECUTION!)

https://i.imgur.com/aAhNHZ9.jpg