Camera Obscura - My Maudlin Career

there's no real plausible deniability here

i agree

why be coy abt it, CaAL? tracyanne campbell has the transphobia brainworms. shit sucks

yeah, i get that.

h8 when bigoted artists trying to be all tight-lipped about what they believe! it's such a crappy feeling every time it comes to light, like i was just sitting there enjoying one of my fave snacks and finally noticed the label where it says the main ingredient is rancid monkey splooge. i didn't want to be enjoying that!

yeah I've learned from experience that people don't want to know about cochineal

Personally, fwiw, it's not so much about plausible deniability, and more about expectations and how strict you want to be with the artists you follow, and how much tracking or work you are ready to do to be consistent about it. This red line is subjective. You can allow artists to be flawed, or disappointing, or bigoted, and it does not mean condoning. Or you don't allow it. In the end, I am not particularly interested in what the Camera Obscura singer thinks about trans rights, at least not any more than anyone in particular, or than any other issue. I do think it's sad if you use your celebrity as a platform to express backward views, and even more if you are militant about it. But an artist is not close enough to me for me to "take action", since I don't see listening to their next album as any form of endorsement of any of her views. Again, I respect people for whom it's a deal breaker when it comes to their attention, whether it's for being personally consistent or because they hope it will have an impact, but I don't see my role as a listener to try to vicariously shut the artist down, that would be militant work imo and more directly achieved with calls to boycott, open letters etc.

And just to say, the above is in no way meant to dismiss how trans people are feeling about artists opposing their rights, it's strictly a personal take on what a listener can/should do.

available on ltd. 'Peak vinyl'

Agree with Nabozo. Especially when the transgression here seems to be largely a matter of guilt by association.

idk what TC did, said, or posted, but I vehemently disagree with framing this as a dispute over "trans rights," unless you think the right to "be alive" or receive appropriate medical care is best understood as a civil right

^^^

i listened to the new album by the smile yesterday, made by a known israel sympathizer and a guy who is at least married to a transphobe, but i guess i rationalize that bc radiohead's music has been a part of my life for so long that i'm always going to want to hear what they're up to and i just gotta hope they fix their hearts in the background of my mind while i'm listening

it is also incredibly easy to be a human being who does not follow graham linehan or like his tweets, because he has been advocating for my annihilation for like almost ten years at this point, maybe longer?

otm, and frankly, liking a tweet is not "guilt by association," it is a public endorsement of someone's speech / viewpoint. you can argue that shouldn't matter either, but it can't be dismissed as mere association

when an artist reveals views like that, it just makes me question their entire public-facing persona, and the sincerity of their art. as if they're trying to con people into believing they're something more than basic bigots with a talent for melody. w/Roisin Murphy, it was probably even worse because her entire career was built upon this supposed embracing of the LGBTQ community, when she actually harbored these deeply ignorant ideas.

idk what TC did, said, or posted, but I vehemently disagree with framing this as a dispute over "trans rights," unless you think the right to "be alive" or receive appropriate medical care is best understood as a civil right

― rob, Wednesday, January 31, 2024 4:45 PM (two hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

I don't really know either so this was a shortcut, although you have me puzzled here. Right to life is a civil right. Health care is a social right.

Maybe this is a cultural difference, but the right to life is not a civil right in my world; it's usually framed as a natural or human right, when it's included in a rights-based analysis. Health care may get framed as a social right (though that's not a term I'm familiar with tbh), but given its direct connection to the right to life, to me it's closer to a human right.

But my point was more that this isn't a political debate over, for example, the right to not be discriminated against at work for being trans, it's a struggle against a deliberate campaign of extermination with the goal of eliminating (annihilating as ivy said) trans people entirely. IMO talking about that as "trans rights" is way overly generous to the fascists who welcome any fig leaf of respectability for their genocidal project.

Civil and political VS economic, social and cultural are the two main categories of human rights for historical reasons, since there were two blocks at the time the Covenants elaborated on the Declaration. You're right that we don't really speak like that any more and just say human rights.

The special attention granted to LGBTQ people is under the angle of discrimination because the rest (protection from threats, hate speech etc) is presumably already covered unless you live in criminalizing countries... except of course that some states have proven to fail / be complicit and then it becomes a judicial battle to enforce. But speaking of rights is still correct imo.