How Important Was Grunge As A Musical Movement?

I never said Nirvana was perfect, but FFS these are virtually rock n roll prerequisites!

I can think of lots that aren't, and many that are only obliquely. I mean do you really think that a song like "Suck You Dry" is about sex? If it is, it's a particularly negative view of sex. Writing songs about how much you hate sex is very grunge. Writing songs that celebrate sex is very hair metal.

Grunge was more truly Dionysian in that it claimed to be all grunt-level emoting (Dionysian) and satisfied, mostly; for one thing it didn't have strict chart-hit order and was sort of loose and when there were guitar solos they were true wandering emoting blurts (not the pert perky ten-second wave-hellos of hair). There was more disordered moaning and shouting, and in some cases more collective shouting, both of which are totally Dionysian. All of which makes it funny that for certain Apollonian eggheads, grunge sounded better than hair.

i admit it's almost impossible for me to be objective about grunge b/c it really was the first music i was passionate about, and for better or worse it sparked my love of music in general. obviously i had to unlearn alot of the things grunge taught me, but i'll never back down from thinking nevermind was an amazing pop record and that in utero was a wonderfully ugly, cathartic masterpiece. i'm also pretty defensive of pearl jam, cos somebody's gotta be.

-- Josh Love (heaveninrowboat...), August 29th, 2004.

dude, you had me until that last sentence...;-)

The Killers' Brandon Flowers has blamed Nirvana and Kurt Cobain for making rock music depressing. Despite the seminal grunge frontman dying almost 15 years ago to the day (he took his life on April 5, 1994), Flowers lambasted Cobain. "I don't mean it in a bad way but I think Kurt Cobain and grunge took the fun out of rock and roll," he said. However, Flowers says that he thinks his band is now making American music "a lot more playful and brighter" (Daily Star/NME).

sort of funny, i really have no knowledge of the original "grunge" bands -- Mudhoney, Green River, early Soundgarden, Melvins, etc. Any of it worth my time? I mean, I generally don't like Pearl Jam, Alice In Chains and their ilk.

Any of it worth my time?

Yeah: Nirvana. Nirvana >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any other grunge band.

the grifters are fucking great. don't know if they really count as 'grunge' but there's certainly some similarities.

People like Melvins, too.

I dunno I'd say the Melvins are better than any of 'em, Nirvana included (I can't listen to Nirvana anymore). The first couple Mudhoney albums are fun but totally juvenile, I would recommend them if you are between the ages of 12 and 21.

sort of funny, i really have no knowledge of the original "grunge" bands -- Mudhoney, Green River, early Soundgarden, Melvins, etc. Any of it worth my time?

Yes, and none of it sounds like Pearl Jam , Alice In Chains(who were both great) or the post-grunge bands (who weren't)

The first couple Mudhoney albums are fun but totally juvenile, I would recommend them if you are between the ages of 12 and 21.

fuck that, im 36 and still listen to Mudhoney.
Funnily enough they are a band who make better cohesive albums in the last 10 years than they did back then.
Melvins last 2 albums have been awesome too.

dude you NEED Superfuzzbigmuff by Mudhoney...it doesn't really sound like "grunge" how you probably think, more like super mean rabid garage rock

heh, yeah I've heard Nirvana ... would probably like Mudhoney, I like the stuff I've heard anyway -- Stooges-y stomping stuff? dunno, I think the main problem I have with most so-called grunge is the vocals. Just a lot of bad singing going on there.

coffin break was pretty rad, but i dunno if they were totally grunge

the deluxe reissue of superfuzzbigmuff is essential.

However, Flowers says that he thinks his band is now making American music "a lot more playful and brighter"

delusions of etc

I've been googling Killers lyrics to refute Branden Flowers lies.

i honestly can't listen to nirvana with anything approaching perspective. i don't think i really like them but it's just colored by way too many other things to tell.

I like the stuff I've heard anyway -- Stooges-y stomping stuff? dunno, I think the main problem I have with most so-called grunge is the vocals. Just a lot of bad singing going on there.

I got off the bus after their major label debut but yeah Stooges are the main reference point and I've always liked Mark Arm's voice. He doesn't do the ass-clenched warbling Eddie Vedder thing.

ha yeah, the ass-clenched warbling Eddie Vedder thing -- that's the big problem. I can remember hearing Pearl Jam when I was a kid and thinking "man i just don't relate to that at all!" obviously some people did/do.

I really liked Eddie Vedders voice, but when all those other bands took the template I can see why it became annoying, but when PJ first hit the singing style was something fresh to many people.

I always hated it

I was just listening to the royal trux's pound for pound a few mins ago

every listen to it

argh I meant to type everyone listen to it

Melvins Live >>>>>>>> Melvins on record >>> Mudhoney > Nirvana >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any other band that got called grunge

while we're on the grunge kick, i never, ever, ever understood why Neil Young got the "godfather of grunge" tag. Are there any grunge bands that actually sound like Neil Young? Even remotely? I know he toured with a lot of them (saw STP open for him in 1993, lol) and did the record with pearl jam but i'll be danged if i hear much Neil Young in those bands. was it just the flannel?

not just flannel, but also volume and sloppiness being used as virtues. but I think it was largely an association thing.

yeah there aren't very many clear similarities (unless we bring Dinosaur Jr into the picture, but they predate grunge "movement" by a bit)

Plus Ragged Glory came out around then and Sonic Youth opened for him and he was in vogue and got name dropped a lot.

right -- i guess there was a period pre-nirvana where grunge could mean dino jr and sonic youth. though honestly, "grunge" seems like the best term to describe Dino Jr, moreso than a lot of grunge bands.