Trump, June 2017: From [Covfefe] with Love

https://heavyeditorial.files.wordpress.com/2017/05/211.jpg?quality=65&strip=all&strip=all

omg NO to thread title, i cannot look at that one day joke for a month

off to a rocky start already, good stuff

*bows*

keeping lib anger alive

But Doctor Casino, don't you realize having covfefe daily keeps the oppo dumps regular?

I'm sure he'll outdo himself later today so wonder what the new fiasco will be.

45 that is

Yeah, please delete this.

Yeah I was as guilty as anyone of jumping on the bandwagon

Wait a sec: "She don't lie, she don't lie, she don't lie, covfefe." Ah, there.

Yeah anyway this is def going to annoy some people so maybe a reboot's in order.

yeah idk y'all – "Trump" in any thread title is a horror worse than anything he can tweet.

"Yeah, please delete this" my suggestion for new thread title

Meaning no disrespect to Alfred - it takes a visionary to start a thread after all. I do feel that any proposed name should be accompanied by a sample of his intended morning greeting, though.

(xpost because phone)

Trump, June 2017: Good Moroning!

^also available as a thread title for a nominal fee.

(not a real suggestion)

Can we get a summary so far at the start of each thread for the casual reader pls thanks

Nigel Farage is 'person of interest' in FBI investigation into Trump and Russia

can we format it like a star wars crawl as well pls, soundtracked by this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qb9dg1R1oPA

great thread title, great photo. please do not change it!

somehow covfefe to me sounds very much like coffee. was he maybe in urgent need of caffeine late at night?

so it should have been: "despite the negative press. coffee!"

Interesting theory!

Jeez, can't believe it's been a year since peeps were complaining about "Hirally Climps for Presidetn" as thread title

Admit it you guys would have eaten it up if it hadn't become a sensation on the rest of the internet. Bunch of nonconformists.

I don't know about these other guys, but I definitely ain't no stinkin' nonconformist.

which thread do we put yesterday's Clinton blamesplainin' in?

That would probably go in the 'Dr. Pavlov, meet Dr. Morbius' thread.

I remember not enjoying seeing "Buttload of faith" every time I wanted to participate. And then wasn't a successor thread named something like "fuck all these assholes, remove bookmark"?

i have a feeling that in a month we're gonna look back on 'covfefe' as a quaint little joke, and long for simpler times --- good title imo

Yeah, Morbs, about that blamesplaining.

how fucking hard is it for people to understand that she ran a lousy campaign AND was negatively affected by Russian hackers/Wikileaks/Comey/disproportionate media coverage. It's possible for there to be more than one reason for something!!!

I think Hillary Clinton should have been president. Sorry, that's just how I feel.

How many thousands of postmortem posts have we scrolled past from everyone and their Aunt Lillian?

It would seem odd if one of the two people most central all this nonsense is allowed to have and express exactly zero thoughts about it (however wrongheaded and/or self-serving those thoughts may be). Especially since the other person most central to all this nonsense is a flaming bag of garbage.

you missed an "also" in there

suggestions for a better Trump June thread title?

how about "Trump in June - as the World Falls Down" or "June must not become Trumpo"

Jareds and Germans and Leakers, oh my

how about "Trump in June - as the World Falls Down" or "June must not become Trumpo"

― Violet Jax (Violet Jynx)

they roll right off the tongue

worst sock ever

Totally pathetic his "I will be announcing" scheme. It seems that everyone knows what he is going to decide concerning the Paris climate agreement except himself.

Donald J. Trump‏Verified Account @realDonaldTrump 13 hours ago
I will be announcing my decision on Paris Accord, Thursday at 3:00 P.M. The White House Rose Garden. MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!

Donald J. Trump‏Verified Account @realDonaldTrump May, 31st
I will be announcing my decision on the Paris Accord over the next few days. MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!

i'd be okay with 'worst sock ever' as a june thread title

props to alfred for thread title

I bet he announces the US will STAY with the paris agreement just to shock everyone

k3vin k otm

there is absolutely zero reason for Trump to stay in the agreement. he only gives a shit about pleasing two groups of people: a) his base, and b) plutocrats. the former (sadly) doesn't give a shit about climate change and the latter of course views responsible environmental policy as a hindrance to making money. this is why i remain at least somewhat optimistic about health care, because that's something his base does care about, and sure enough Trump has managed to periodically undermine AHCA via tweet.

xp

I bet he announces the US will STAY with the paris agreement just to shock everyone

yeah but he's president! THEREFORE, America is great.

I would have gone with "Trump In June: The Rule of Turds" but neofolk references are rarely crowd pleasers

I bet he announces the US will STAY with the penis agreement

^ read thusly. did not lol, but was tempted.

The US is expected to remain united in agreement that Trump is a penis.

Trump's penis belongs to Putin

a nice amuse bouche for the beginning of the month. bon appetit!

http://thehill.com/homenews/house/335886-gop-rep-on-climate-change-god-will-take-care-of-it

b) plutocrats... view responsible environmental policy as a hindrance to making money.

This is not accurate. The plutocrats, incl those actually in his cabinet, rightly see $$$ to be made from climate change mitigation policies and technologies. It's a growth industry in huge demand already generating tons of activity and money.

“I believe there’s climate change,” Walberg said at a town hall last Friday in Coldwater, Mich., according to the Huffington Post, which obtained video of the exchange.

“I believe there’s been climate change since the beginning of time. I think there are cycles. Do I think that man has some impact? Yeah, of course. Can man change the entire universe? No.”

“Why do I believe that? Well, as a Christian, I believe that there is a creator in God who is much bigger than us. And I’m confident that, if there’s a real problem, he can take care of it.”

sure! like he averted the 2004 tsunami, for example, or the 2010 haiti earthquakes, for example

thx god u the best

Yeah, of course. Can man change the entire universe? No.”

we're not talking about the fucking climate in alpha centauri you stupid cunt

I agree with the GOP that god will 'take care of it,' in much the same sense that a Mafia don would ask one of his button men to 'take care of it.'

I careen down the freeway with my hands off the wheel and trust that god will 'take care of it.' P.S. I am functionally brain dead and do not understand how reality works.

I don't think it matters much whether the US stays with the Paris agreement or not, for the simple reason that, as Οὖτις said above, America's billionaire class is already moving toward more environmentally friendly policies with or without the government. Trump can stomp his foot and bark about coal all he wants; the fact is, solar and wind are cheaper than fossil fuels now, and that's all that matters to big business. We're gonna wind up complying with environmental regulations despite ourselves, for the same reason we do everything else: out of greed and self-interest.

so you're saying he was right all along?

how are they ever going to make a two hour movie out of all this? hope oliver stone stays healthy:

"The source mentioned Farage’s links with Roger Stone, Trump’s long-time political adviser who has admitted being in contact with Guccifer 2.0, a hacker whom US intelligence agencies believe to be a Kremlin agent."

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jun/01/nigel-farage-is-person-of-interest-in-fbi-investigation-into-trump-and-russia?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

i think anything which strengthens the belief that climate change is a myth is extremely dangerous, and it's hard to imagine what better propaganda win for climate-change deniers there could be than the world's second-largest polluter pulling out of a major international agreement on emissions

xposts The reason for Hillary to refrain from "blamesplaining" is not because she's incorrect or shouldn't be president right now.

It's because we're in a fucking crisis, and putting this crisis in the context of who won the election alienates the 50+% of the population who view her unfavorably. It completely plays into Trump's hands. Thanks for your service, but we have the FBI, two congressional committees, basically the entire fourth estate, and an infuriated public on the case. Please go away, you are not helping.

she appreciates the advice

with climate and business i figure it will just take some big oil company figuring out how to own the solar panels on every house in america to get things rolling. green can equal greed just as much as anything else can.

what she appreciates is her place in history

Is it cool if she starts talking shit midway through his second term?

I don't care whether she stays or goes but this Pierce column makes strong points:

Frankly, I hope she continues to "frustrate" Democratic panjandrums and I hope she continues to make the likes of Ruth Marcus simper about how bitter she is. Right now, as far as I can see, HRC is the only one completely free to hammer away at the extraordinary events that conspired to put Donald Trump in the White House. As the investigations continue to accelerate, the country needs somebody outside of the Congress and outside of Department of Justice to keep the country at large focused on the real cost of having abided by the Clinton Rules while an election was hijacked from afar. Might as well be her.

http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a55410/hillary-clinton-2016-election-comments/

OKAY THIS IS A CONCEPT ARE YOU READY:

hillary runs for prez again and her campaign slogan?

Hindsight is 2020

— seems bad (@glaserface) May 31, 2017

xpost it would have been cooler still if she had won MI PA WI OH

HRC is the only one completely free to hammer away at the extraordinary events that conspired to put Donald Trump in the White House

^this is such bullshit

this thread is cursed

xpost it would have been cooler still if she had won MI PA WI OH

― Hadrian VIII,

it would've been cooler had voter fraud not happened in Wisconsin

the people who care about "the extraordinary events that conspired to put Donald Trump in the White House" aren't tabling that concern anytime soon, and the people who don't care aren't going to start caring because Hillary talks about it. I have no problem with her offering her own diagnosis of the election when asked but we shouldn't pretend it's going to win any Democrats any new votes.

Don't worry – she doesn't get air time. Ruth Marcus and Chris Cilizza do.

I think grawlix has a bullseye

kinda amused by this idea that Hillary has a responsibility to win over people who irrationally hate her and don't care about reason or logic

Hey let's try to build consensus that Trump is a puppet of Vladimir Putin, we'll put in charge the person who said exactly that on national television six months ago, that'll get the message over

Yeah, but she was just saying that to get elected, man. Now that she lost, people might listen to her.

"in charge"

we shouldn't pretend it's going to win any Democrats any new votes

is anyone pretending this

Honestly, there is very little about all these Russian investigations that weren't brought up months ago (go figure). People don't give a shit, because they are ignorant or assholes or just going about their lives.

Nothing Clinton will say will change anybody's mind (did Al Gore change anyone's mind when he protested the Iraq War?) but she doesn't have to shut up.

I think Al Gore's movie had an effect, tbh. Lotta good it did, but it did have an effect.

Shifting from his previous blanket denials, President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia said on Thursday that “patriotically minded” private Russian hackers could have been involved in cyberattacks last year to help the presidential campaign of Donald J. Trump.

"in charge"

― the Rain Man of nationalism. (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, June 1, 2017 11:01 AM (one minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Alfred the Clintons are an institution which for most of the last few decades has been interchangeable with the DNC. Hillary was the party nominee. It seems naive to imagine that by speaking out she will she be received as anything other than the official voice of the opposition.

we shouldn't pretend it's going to win any Democrats any new votes

is anyone pretending this

it's only the point of doing anything that's not just offering up more grist for the cable news mill.

“patriotically minded” private Russian hackers - spies like us

there is nothing productive any Clinton can do at this point but disappear

I don't mean to conflate the debate over everyone still piling on Hillary with this idea that she's going to be a meaningful voice in the resistance. in other words, I find the link Alfred posted from The Week a lot more otm than the Pierce excerpt.

It seems naive to imagine that by speaking out she will she be received as anything other than the official voice of the opposition.

Ha – isn't it naive to think she will be received as the official voice of the opposition?

I find the link Alfred posted from The Week a lot more otm than the Pierce excerpt.

I agree. I was more interested in his take on The Clinton Rules.

it will be interesting (though more like just "depressing") to see how the next serious (Democratic) female candidate for president is treated. because I do think a lot of people were able to mask (even to themselves, perhaps) outright misogyny with a general distaste for The Clintons as a decades-long political reality. Pocahontas memes aren't going to provide nearly as much cover.

It seems naive to imagine that by speaking out she will she be received as anything other than the official voice of the opposition.

Ha – isn't it naive to think she will be received as the official voice of the opposition?

― the Rain Man of nationalism. (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, June 1, 2017 11:13 AM (three minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

No, I think this is the stupid, default narrative w/ opposing teams that the media defaults to

It doesn't matter. It's all in Mueller and God's hands.

the Clintons are an institution which for most of the last few decades has been interchangeable with the DNC.

Interesting definitions of "most" "few" and "interchangeable" here

i sort of hate the tendency among (presumably moderate) democrats to pillory those among them who successfully arouse the ire of fuckheads. "shut up, hillary, you're only making them mad." or all those goddam thinkpieces about the alienation of angry red state bigots. like god forbid we antagonize the klan.

this thread so far in a nutshell

http://live.francetvinfo.fr/uploads/2016/8/17/1/57b3a5ed66747662ac840000.gif

If that dude was Trump he'd still somehow win.

that's the spirit

if that dude was violet jynx he'd still somehow post

the Clintons are an institution which for most of the last few decades has been interchangeable with the DNC.

Interesting definitions of "most" "few" and "interchangeable" here

― El Tomboto, Thursday, June 1, 2017 11:27 AM (fifteen minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

The DNC has been populated by Clintonites since 1992, not sure what's so interesting abt the langauge

I think his point is that we haven't even reached "a few" decades

it will be interesting ... to see how the next serious (Democratic) female candidate for president is treated. because I do think a lot of people were able to mask ... outright misogyny with a general distaste for The Clintons...

― evol j, Thursday, June 1, 2017 8:20 AM (seven minutes ago)

it'll be interesting, yeah, but i wouldn't take her example as bellwether. she's a uniquely powerful hate magnet, even among those who would otherwise support her party & policies, even among those willing to overlook bill's many flaws. misogyny can't be separated from that, but it's not the whole story. and she ran a bad campaign, and she made some terrible early decisions re that stupid fucking email nonsense, and comey conspired with the russians to shank her, and the democrats quietly bailed on the american worker two decades ago, and trump's idiot savant news cycle dominance powers gave him a massive edge from day one. etc.

xpost 2.5 decades is a few

Interesting definition of 'populated' there. But so many things are interesting when you speak ESL.

Is Hadrian American?

she made some terrible early decisions re that stupid fucking email nonsense

a mistake that her predecessors made too but didn't have "Clinton" as a last name?

Her campaign was no worse than anybody else's. Her campaign sucked because she lost.

can someone ping me when you guys have this figured out finally, gonna check out for awhile

I'm gonna get the papers get the papers

Hey Frederik is go fuck yourself native enough?

I'm fine with someone else making the cofefe houses joke, but to the extent HRC has an audience, 1) she shouldn't stoop to DJT's level, and 2) there are much bigger problems to address than DJT, which the election simply made visible.

Thought experiment, what could Hillary Rawham Clinton done differently to won the election (the 2016 election for presidetn of USA of america)? I'm asking for a friend but I think this could generate some very interesting conversation!

been remixed by Justin Bieber

I don't watch sports, but do those ESPN guys larp their way through last year's Super Bowl every day?

Dude fans of the losing team larp through a Super Bowl loss for the rest of their lives

...a mistake that her predecessors made too but didn't have "Clinton" as a last name?

spicer attempts to defend kushner by saying back channels are sop. they are, of course, but that's irrelevant. the existence of this particular "channel" is suspicious in light of the comically obvious.

hillary's email habits were unremarkable. but in the early days of her campaign, under intensely public scrutiny and with the myth of clinton dishonesty already well established, she chose again and again to stall, deny and half-disclose. guilty of nothing, she did everything possible to keep keep doubt alive.

and okay, fine, no mas

Guys guys I heard you were discussing what Hilary did wrong itt I came right over, where we at?

her wedding

Ironic to see Hadrian VIII complaining about dynasty imo

Had HRC run on issues rather than character, she might have won. Most of Trump's voters knew he was a repugnant person.

But the great flaw was in the Democratic leadership and fundraising. There were many potential candidates that were deterred from entering the race due to the perceived insurmountable lead HRC had, and none were weighed down decades of calumnies. I'm not sure Sanders could have won facing the ton of (R) oppo during the general, but others like Jim Webb certainly could have.

Hillery should have gotten with the patriotic russioan hackers

Jim Webb is human garbage who looks like a Dick Tracy villain and should be sealed in a barrel and floated out to sea.

Ironic to see Hadrian VIII complaining about dynasty imo

― D'mnuchin returns (darraghmac), Thursday, June 1, 2017 4:25 PM (one minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

A+

I don't watch sports, but do those ESPN guys larp their way through last year's Super Bowl every day?

The problem being that the systems and mindsets that led to the loss are still in place.

why anyone expends any positive energy on politicians to the right of Warren remains a mystery to me

some comic relief from across the pond

The mayor of Manchester, a member of the Labor Party, learnedly explains that the US and UK never intervened in the mideast before 9/11 pic.twitter.com/n51OzuJVkV

— Jon Schwarz (@tinyrevolution) June 1, 2017

Iron Law of Institutions?

XP to simon: because they run everything?

also

Yeah, the Paris accords are pretty weak stuff, but the enlightened wing of the business class is freaking out. pic.twitter.com/jc3gMWybO2

— Doug Henwood (@DougHenwood) June 1, 2017

Rolling Stone: 'Donald Trump' Tops List of New Meth Nicknames

I missed the part where Jim Webb was "deterred from entering the race." Could have sworn I saw him in the first debate.

he was deterred by all the faces he saw everywhere scowling at him

I think humans will only agree to climate change actions once their houses are flooded and destroyed and they cant buy gas for their cars cause its too expensive.

Just being optimistic!

XP to simon: because they run everything?

I meant in terms of hopes for the future, candidacies, etc. Neoliberalism is a dead end.

it still blows my mind that there was a cover feature in the nation praising webb early on as he ran for senator

xp: Simon

Because enough voters don't really know left from right (cf Trump's base), and are looking at things like domineering bearing or whether the candidate reminds them of their ex. I hope we'll see a progressive in the WH soon, but I wouldn't be surprised if that progressive was a military vet.

It's not about knowing left from right, it's about addressing people's material concerns in a credible way. Maybe then some of that 45% that sits elections out will turn up.

Because enough voters don't really know left from right (cf Trump's base), and are looking at things like domineering bearing or whether the candidate reminds them of their ex. I hope we'll see a progressive in the WH soon, but I wouldn't be surprised if that progressive was a military vet.

Moulton '20

Sanpaku OTM. Trumpbase's material concerns are being put through a wood chipper and they don't care.

well he's "shakin' things up"!

it's about addressing people's material concerns in a credible way.

WilliamC otm, Trump's core supporters don't process their material concerns in a way that reflects their politics.

or rather their political positions don't reflect their material concerns

Did u miss the part where I wasn't talking about Trump's "core supporters"

I'm talking about the millions and millions of people who feel (correctly, I think) alienated from the mainstream American political process and don't bother participating as a result

Yeah, even I took Simon's comment to mean that there are votes to be won among the 45% of turned-off nonvoters The Trumpoids won't be convinced by any means anyways so why try

DJP blowing up the moulton.house.gov uniques

When thousands of small manufacturers closed factories in small town USA and moved operations to places like China and Mexico, many of the workers decided it was all the fault of the Chinese and Mexicans.

i can't wait for trump's reality show style countdown to 3pm EST - will he decide to shit all over the world again? will some rich guy convince him not to do it? who will be the last person to whisper in his ear? has he learned anything about why coal mining jobs are disappearing? will he share his discovery of natural gas from earlier this morning? will he refer to climate change as a conspiracy so far reaching that it involves nearly all scientists who have worked on the issue PLUS china, but somehow all evidence of this globalist plot involving tens or even hundreds of thousands of people has been buried (by the lying fake news?!!?!)!?!?!?!?!!? ALL THIS AND MORE AT 3PM EST, sign up for a 3-day free hulu trial to watch live and we'll send you a climate change barf bag!

BREAKING: Former FBI director James Comey to testify before Senate Intel next THURSDAY, June 8, at 10 a.m.

— Seung Min Kim (@seungminkim) June 1, 2017

When thousands of small manufacturers closed factories in small town USA and moved operations to places like China and Mexico, many of the workers decided it was all the fault of the Chinese and Mexicans.

I wonder if this might have something to do with the lack of class awareness in American society leaving people inventing foreign boogeymen

You think the hearings are going to be a summer-long thing like Iran-Contra or something where it's just on in the background for months?

You wander into the lunch room to grab a snack and notice on the flatscreen there's yet another tie-wearing grimaced white dude talking in a mic behind some chyron and a scroll

I wonder if this might have something to do with the lack of class awareness in American society leaving people inventing foreign boogeymen

pretty sure that stoking the flames of xenophobia in the face of domestic hardships is a common move throughout the world and history

^ Chapter eight in the Oligarchic Best Practices Handbook.

pretty sure that stoking the flames of xenophobia in the face of domestic hardships is a common move throughout the world and history

Well, yeah. Hence the need to counter it with something more effective than centrist sloganeering.

Sorry, this is the Trump thread, not the new left policy thread, I'll shut up now

Just FYI, this is what gives us "we spend too much time talking about race" thinkpieces from the racist left.

I've become pessimistic about this Russia inquiry.

I don't think the disinformation campaign was as organized and targeted as Hillary claimed in that recent interview. All the "fake news" was just following the lead of right wing narratives about the Clintons that had been going on for decades. Russia would not need the help of Cambridge Analytica to make certain kinds of stories go viral among this audience.

I do agree with her that this stuff had an effect. Many voters probably did stay home because they were confused and thought she was about to be arrested or whatever. This sucks but does it indicate "collusion"? How much of what Russia did -- outside the hacks themselves -- was original and how much was just using bots to amplify stories that were circulating on their own? Also how much of the disinformation was from russia and how much was profit driven?

I want Clinton to be right and for Trump to get carted off to jail but it just doesn't seem like a plausible reading of the events to me.

xposts
not to say that simon's wrong, just that it's not unique to americans. one of the reasons it's a classic move is that it often works. people aren't just empty shells ready to receive evil directions from their political leaders; there's something in us that craves a scapegoat.

Wonder how long Spicer is going to remain loyal. After not being allowed along on the papal visit how many more mistweets is he going to defend.
JUst caught up with last night's Chris Hayes which had the soundtrack to yesterday's press briefing.
where he's left continually asking
Blake?
Blake?
Blake?
Blake?
Blake?

after being asked what the neologism meant.

Just FYI, this is what gives us "we spend too much time talking about race" thinkpieces from the racist left.

Huh?

http://www.nbcnews.com/video/kanye-west-stop-focusing-on-racism-812186179719

Kanye West said he wanted to talk about "race and the idea of racism."

I guess this is as good a time as any to head to the TNC thread and talk about RL Stephens' piece.

https://thumbs.worthpoint.com/zoom/images1/1/0809/31/mcdonalds-grimace-novelty-neck-tie_1_5b47d1d952e93ae8f5bf4c9079b8ee84.jpg

http://www.newsweek.com/congress-investigates-another-possible-sessions-kislyak-meeting-cnn-618964

“I did not have communications with the Russians.”

should be "those Russians" imo

I'm trying to stay pessimistic about the Russia stuff but there is just...so...much...there

CLinton was sucked by a mouth and he was impeached - Trump sucked the world dry and was let be.

nah this is crippling his administration, with any luck it will drag on forever

please untype xp

lol

So...he's doing exactly what everyone predicted he would do.

On a conference call with Capitol Hill staffers ahead of the speech, White House energy policy adviser Michael Catanzaro confirmed that “the United States is getting out of the Paris agreement.” Trump, Catanzaro said, “will be open to and will immediately be looking for a better deal.” A source provided The Daily Beast with the call-in information. The process could be a lengthy one. Catanzaro said the administration will follow the steps for withdrawal laid out in the deal itself. “We will initiate the process, which, all told, takes four years in total. But we’re going to make very clear to the world that we’re not going to be abiding by what the previous administration agreed to.”

I love how "fuck you, Obama!" is such a broad governing principle - it covers every aspect of life!

“will be open to and will immediately be looking for a better deal.”

what a fucking joke

Born June 14, 1946 in New York, Donald Trump made a fortune in real estate, an empire that he inherited from his father and made fruit. Ex-animator televised, the businessman also has golf courses, a model agency, and a multitude of derivatives. The Republican is the favorite of his camp for the US presidential election of 2016. He has three children with his first wife, Ivana Zelníčková, a daughter with his second wife, Marla Maples, and a last son with his wife since 2005 , Melania Knauss."

he'' never get out of the paris match!
http://www.parismatch.com/People-A-Z/Donald-Trump

just come out and say he doesn't think climate change is real. that's the reason. he's said it many times. that's what the people who voted for him think. just say it.

“will be open to and will immediately be looking for a better deal.”

wtf? The Paris climate accords include ~200 signatory nations, bucko. Who is going to give us this "better" deal?

And "better" how? "Better" because we are allowed to fuck up the planet worse than we could under the Paris agreement? How is a more fucked-up planet "better" for us?

esad

just come out and say he doesn't think climate change is real.

I don't think he gives a fuck one way or the other. all he cares about are the optics: fulfilling a campaign promise, saying "fuck you" to Obama, taking a controversial position

the obligations under the paris "deal" that he's objecting to were going to be very easy to meet for the united states (in no small part due to natural gas displacing coal). it already was a good "deal" for the united states. if the actual goal was to help mitigate the chances of this world being even more of a shithole than it already is in the future, it wasn't nearly ambitious enough.

it is anti-globalist, but in the worst possible way

Hoping that somebody more sensible will come in before the actual exit. But it's not a good place to be placing focus. Monetarising environmental disaster. Lovely.

The Paris climate accords include ~200 signatory nations, bucko. Who is going to give us this "better" deal?

Some other, biglier planet, with better, classier countries. You'll see. Trust him.

I hear the ZXBr'Glrg Accord of Stardate 458.7x mandate gold toilets for everyone.

"It'll be like we never even had a black president."

in 4 years we'll have a different president so there's that

xp

adding to the irony of all this is that the u.s., historically, has been one of the major dissenters to global climate agreements (on the opposite side of the negotiating spectrum from the island countries who we have fucked over), even to extent of watering down the language in the IPCC's reports, which must be unanimously approved. so we stick around long enough to water down the paris accord, and then promptly elect a fuckface and bail out of the agreement

Yeah, so I'm absolutely never bringing children into this world. Go fucking die horribly, you petulant blob of shit.

no children get to have recess until they play my rules. and my rules are that only kickball is allowed, and that i'm the only one who gets to kick it. you have to go chase it down and then let me kick it again. and give me a pretty smooth roll with just a few bumps. plus i get to cherry bomb it whenever i want.

*recess finally begins as sad children trudging out to once again retrieve the cherry-bombed USA ball wherever it goes*

uh i'm not into this deal. *takes ball and runs away*

if this dumb recess story of mine ends as it should, all the other children will beat the living shit out of the usa after school

if only someone would DARE Trump to stay in the agrement he may do it

I'm trying to stay pessimistic about the Russia stuff but there is just...so...much...there

And so much of it seems to be thinly sourced...

Why the media is not trusted: no evidence that Russia hacked Macron says French state cyber security agency. https://t.co/XanI8dthyR pic.twitter.com/73tk2YNcl5

— Nina🦉Byzantina (@NinaByzantina) June 1, 2017

I'm talking pretty much exclusively about stuff confirmed by our intelligence agencies

an empire that he inherited from his father and made fruit. Ex-animator televised, the businessman...

Not sure what happened to this sentence, but wasn't "Ex-animator Televised" a song by The Fall?

One last (perhaps):

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DBQT3wfXgAQkw2s.jpg

sorry my French isnt so good

TIL: French for quizmaster and master of ceremonies is "animateur".

Call us if you experience an election lasting longer than four hours (xp2Sanpaku)

still waiting on the press conference to start (live video here for those who enjoy pain).

wonder if he'll take any questions.

"Oops. The comedian and humorist Kathy Griffin apologized after posting pictures of Donald Trump's head beheaded. CNN, where Kathy Griffin hosted an annual show at Christmas condemned these images, deeming them "sickening and offensive." The US news channel was pleased with the host's apology. Very moved, Kathy Griffin expressed his sincere regrets in video, saying to have understood that his photos had exceeded the limits and were too shocking. Donald Trump did not fail to stigmatize the brutality of these images recalling Jihadist terrorism."

stop posting

Jihadist terrorism? I just thought Salome / John the Baptist or Judith / Holofernes.

even frank fucking luntz knows what's up

Ahead of Trump's announcement, a majority of Americans in every state support staying in the #ParisAgreement.https://t.co/eSJRKoBfDH pic.twitter.com/wXzwrZ5tfT

— Frank Luntz (@FrankLuntz) June 1, 2017

Fuck Donald Trump

There is no reason to know either way, but I predict backlash. It is just such a pointless affront.

Talk about childish, he's like a little kid who knows he's a total fuck up and just doesn't give a shit, so wants to take everybody down with him. He's pissing in the world biggest pool.

if the backlash is focused on the environment, i hope the protests (if there are any) are better organized the two dueling science/climate change marches (March for Science on 4/22 and the People's Climate March on 4/29, with various environmental organizations squaring off against each other rather than, i don't know, uniting against the obvious clear present danger and just holding ONE FUCKING MARCH

good fucking LORD that was demoralizing

yeah that was weird/bad

It's really hard to feel anything other than loathing towards the US right now. No matter how many US'ers are disgusted with Trump and the GOP's actions, none of this should have been even remotely conceivable in the first place. And fuck seeking excuses for what is objectively the most powerful country in the world.

can you imagine the women's march if it would have devolved into one group of organizations who wanted to focus on access to reproductive health care holding, holding a march on january 14th, with a second group demanding that the focus be on ensuring equal wages and benefits in the workplace holding a separate march on the 21st?

alright, the feed is live.

we're a fully blown rogue state now!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enGiN6AwgoU

Why is it that narcissistic shitbags seem so much better at overcoming the narcissism of small differences in their pursuit of evil?

None of the marches mean shit unless they take place in places other than Democratic stronghold cities. 10 people, 10,000 people, 100,000 people, it all matters not unless people turn out on election day and vote these assholes out.

why is pence introducing this like it's a celebration?

whatever he says, it will be historic. this will go down in history as just an obvious, stupid, STUPID mistake, just completely misguided, against the strong opposition of literally the entire world except for one political party in the midst of sheer madness

Honestly, there is very little about all these Russian investigations that weren't brought up months ago (go figure). People don't give a shit

I don't think either of these statements is true?

I don't know that people don't give a shit, but it's also not clear to me that a clear narrative of corruption is being presented in the same way that it was for, say, Watergate.

sleeve!!!!

go fuck yourself, troll

this isn't a fucking joke, asshole

there's a cheering section at this announcement. who are these people? they gave him an ovation

Honestly, there is very little about all these Russian investigations that weren't brought up months ago (go figure). People don't give a shit

Watergate took a year and a half to get going

All these characters, from Manafort to Page to Cohen to Stone, etc., people have been talking about them for months. Not to mention Trump himself, who was shady from day one. So yeah, some of the finer points of detail re: Flynn or Sessions are new, and the Comey twist is new, but there was enough to go on before the election. People. Do. Not. Give. A. Shit.

If people give a shit they will vote out the GOP. If they don't ... they don't. And I have my doubts, because they elected this fucking piece of shit in the first place.

Somewhere in Trump's sick mind he at least considered how he could use this as a bargaining chip. If we can let these totally, totally false Russian accusations go, maybe I won't hasten the extinction of life on earth. Sad!

These tweets worth reading: http://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2017/06/trump-identity-politics

Watergate took a year and a half to get going, fine. But we are well post Watergate, we know the drill, and in the meantime day after day Trump is fucking everything up. By the time we emerge from the other side, assuming anything even happens, someone will have to clean up all this shit he smeared all over everything.

Yes the pullout is damaging but the fact that it's TRUMP who's doing it taints climate-denialism by association...

Doesn't it? (Please say it does)

why is pence introducing this like it's a celebration?

there's a cheering section at this announcement. who are these people?

"Because fuck Obama" and "because liberal tears / liberal 'splodey heads" is really all the explanation needed, both for the pullout and for the air of celebration. It's just a big fat Culture War zing, and it didn't require marshaling a Senate vote, getting through a Federal court, or any of those pesky details.

Like, with no question there is tenfold times the shit going on as there was during Watergate, it's all right out there for even armchair investigators to see. Perjury, conflicts of interest. It's all right there. But there are serious things at stake here with global implications, you'd think it'd expedite things a bit.

The right is almost pure identity id at this point. There is no policy agenda, just hatred of "latte liberals," people of color, immigrants.

— sean. (@SeanMcElwee) May 31, 2017

they aren't being let go, they are sucking all the air out of Trump's presidency and hobbling congressional legislative agenda. In that sense it doesn't matter if the public at large "doesn't give a shit" (although I think they do, for the most part), what matters is that it is crippling him politically. Why do you think he's making such a big deal of this Paris Accord withdrawal? It's one of the few things left that he can do without Congress (I'm gonna let you guess what the others are - they aren't pretty either)

xp

here comes a litany of misleading lies from trump. this is revolting.

trump just criticized the paris accord for not promoting "clean coal" enough, which is one dumb thing, but also...doesn't his own budget cut funding for "clean coal"?
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/trumps-budget-hits-renewables-hard-but-clean-coal-also-starves/article/2623937

his lies aren't even consistent

why start now

I wonder if they cancelled that Iowa rally because this was going to take its place

I'm gonna let you guess what the others are - they aren't pretty either

Favor us.

^^^ bring it on

what matters is that it is crippling him politically

In what sense? Because from Trump through Sessions to Pruitt to whomever, they are still doing shitty horrible things, whether it has to go through congress or not. The only argument that can be made is that it could be even worse.

does everyone else think I should stop posting too?

Actually feel sick at the amount of stupidity in this speech. It's moronic!

In what sense? Because from Trump through Sessions to Pruitt to whomever, they are still doing shitty horrible things, whether it has to go through congress or not. The only argument that can be made is that it could be even worse.

that's the only argument to make! why is this not important??

Because the prospect of worse does not make terrible better!

...

Josh, your basis for argument seems to be that if it's not good enough to get this administration thrown out now, it's not worth bothering with.

Favor us.

things a President can do without Congress = foreign policy, ie rip up treaties, fuck up alliances, start wars, etc. you know, the good stuff!

Jfc heard 30 seconds of this shit on NPR and feeling homicidal.

the whitehouse feed keeps cutting to this shot of 3-rows of trump supporters, carefully cropped so that no one else is in the same frame. it's so obviously fake and manufactured

I don't watch him talk, I'm not a glutton for punishment

also are you really hoping for something unexpected to happen? I mean

I'm hoping someone brings me a gin and tonic.

otm

I'm hoping for a protester to yell "FUCK YOOOOOoooooo"

this speech is actually shaping up to be one of his most explicit and prominent expressions of xenophobism, "anti-globalism", bannonism

I'm hoping for more than that. (xp)

He's basically declared trade war on Europe and China.

And the USA will lose that.

Watergate took a year and a half to get going

Hmmm, more like 10 months really. And the mean attention span is about a tenth of what it was then.

Paul Ryans statement is basically 'fuck obama lol'

Pruitt's talking now.

what a fucking prick

his nose so deep up trump's asshole, the buttcheeks making little hollow cupping noises as they clap over pruitt's ears

He's basically declared trade war on Europe and China.

The US will get coal mines, we'll get renewables. The guy is a deal-making genius

thank you for a note of black humor, appreciated

does everyone else think I should stop posting too?

― Violet Jax (Violet Jynx), Thursday, June 1, 2017 2:50 PM (eleven minutes ago)

wholeheartedly

he took no questions

yea i'm not going to watch this

Looks like the UK picked the wrong time to hitch its wagon to the Poor Old USA.

the mean attention span is about a tenth of what it was then

it is probably easy to believe that one can accurately estimate an entire population's average attention span when one only pays attention to three things

bold prediction
scott pruitt will become a U.S. senator and he will be even more hatable than ted cruz

savin' that for ilx first mentions but it seems so likely

guys the FP button under Violet Jynx's posts is in the same place as everybody else's posts

please stop confusing being mildly annoying with being hateful, etc.

I can't believe I'm posting this

lol @ Musk throwing a temper tantrum and leaving his "economic councils" as if that counts for shit

I'm glad he's bankrolling Solarcity and Tesla and battery storage projects and space exploration but god he is such a tool

xp I tried that already, it didn't work

one can accurately estimate an entire population's average attention span when one only pays attention to mobile-electronics-obsessed zombies

Don't misrepresent me — I've never said or thought VJ was hateful. I just wish he'd vanish.

^^^

Josh, your basis for argument seems to be that if it's not good enough to get this administration thrown out now, it's not worth bothering with.

I don't know, the GOP congress under Obama was capable enough to hold/fuck things up just for the hell of it, and Trump can with a single fart undo or at least fuck up any sign of progress ... if it's that easy to do a bad job, or just destroy for destruction's sake, then maybe none of it is worth bothering with. Like, to what end? As long as there are people stupid enough to nihilistically turn the clock back, what is the point if it's relatively easy for them to do so? Because even if the congress and White House went blue, they can't just undo the shit Trump is undoing. What's taking him months to destroy was often the product of years of effort. And even if all the investigations take him down, his replacements are just as bad for all the same reasons. And if all of these investigations don't take him down, then ... seriously, why bother? We're doomed.

Trump getting elected period remains just so innately disheartening.

i'm just gonna cast aside any degree of investment in my health and any specific plans for the future. maybe i'll start smoking cigarettes or something. why not?

Because even if the congress and White House went blue, they can't just undo the shit Trump is undoing

be specific, because in many cases they can actually undo the shit he is doing

and let's be really clear here - repealing the ACA, pushing through an insane tax cut, building a wall on the Mexican border, etc. - these are all things with horrible, horrible consequences and it is a good thing that they are being stopped.

Are they being stopped or just seriously slowed? You can't stop something that hasn't happened yet, and I can't tell if they've been stopped or merely stymied by the gross incompetence of this administration.

Oh, and you want specific? OK. How about ... the Paris Climate Accord? Can we just rejoin? Or if some ACA replacement passes in some shape or form in the next few years ... can that just be changed? How about tax cuts, if they ever happen? Good luck getting enough momentum getting tax hikes passed, even if it's just to bring things up to old levels.

Paris Climate Accord? Can we just rejoin?

probably

that's what I'm wondering. US can't actually withdraw until 2020, so if a Dem/non-idiot president wins, can't they just rejoin?

The fuse is a little longer than most, but this is basically a genocidal act. Made out of willful ignorance and spite, by a reality show star.

How widespread was voter revulsion towards Nixon and understanding of what Watergate meant when it went down? Because I only really know from Perlstein tomes, but I get a sense that maybe a lot of people didn't get/care what he'd been doing wrong? Like Trump's apologists now? The only difference is they got Twitter (and he hasn't gone down yet)

Why would the world wait for us to do so? Like Brexit, I assume damage is done.

We can but who would take our word? President Pruitt can withdraw again in 2024.

Or if some ACA replacement passes in some shape or form in the next few years ... can that just be changed?

yes, if the votes in congress are there. ditto taxes (remember the battle over letting Bush's ridiculous tax cuts expire?)

xp

Also what does You can't stop something that hasn't happened yet mean because as a koan its kind of imparsable.

Why would the world wait for us to do so? Like Brexit, I assume damage is done.

they're not going to wait. the other signatories are going to move forward.

How widespread was voter revulsion towards Nixon and understanding of what Watergate meant when it went down? Because I only really know from Perlstein tomes, but I get a sense that maybe a lot of people didn't get/care what he'd been doing wrong? Like Trump's apologists now? The only difference is they got Twitter (and he hasn't gone down yet)

― Who's puttin' sponge in the zings I once zung (stevie), T

A Democratic Congress made a difference. So did two congressional committees and an independent prosecutor quietly accumulating such damning evidence that GOP resistance crumbled. Remember: it was Barry Goldwater who marched into the Oval Office to tell Nixon he had no support in Congress.

xpost Meaning the ACA tax cuts et al. are still on the table. They can still happen. So they haven't been stopped, as such, the way the travel ban has literally been stopped.

Also I'm pretty sure if UK got woke and repealed Brexit the EU would welcome us back like the undeserving shitheel prodigal sons we are

I get that, Alfred - I'm talking in terms of the electorate themselves.

as far as ACA and taxes, the GOP in congress really only has until the end of this summer to make that work, and it doesn't look very likely to happen. The GOP caucuses in the Senate and the House don't agree, they're stymied by the reconciliation rules, and the Dem opposition is totally united. Historically, this is not a recipe for success for massive legislative overhauls, esp w an erratic, incompetent and unpopular President on the sidelines.

by the time next year rolls around, it's going to be mid-terms and GOP numbers are gonna be in the toilet.

A devil's advocate would argue ACA repeal is a prologue to Medicare for all. Terrible for those who get injured/sick from '19 to '22, but ultimately good.

Rejecting the Paris Accords may mean an international consensus with teeth. Universal carbon tariffs on nations who aren't meeting goals set by outside authorities. A better path, going forward.

At present, what's really at danger is American leadership of the free world. America didn't lead through fear, but shared values, and in 2016 it clearly demonstrated its internal political games trump values. That admirational/aspirational acceptance of one nation's leadership didn't come cheaply, and American voters threw it away with little thought, so some could have a tantrum.

the way the travel ban has literally been stopped.

it's not in the SC yet, where it will be upheld 5-4 IMO

re: Russia scandal - tbf the opinions of the electorate don't really matter, it's the opinions of people in Congress and the courts that matter

xp

Sanpaku otm

it's not in the SC yet, where it will be upheld 5-4 IMO

idk about this, we will see

by the time they rule the thing will have expired anyway

That admirational/aspirational acceptance of one nation's leadership didn't come cheaply, and American voters threw it away with little thought, so some could have a tantrum.

I wouldn't get too carried away with that admirational/aspirational thing.

No, or you could equally make the argument that if it could survive Iraq, Afghanistan and Kyoto, it can survive Paris.

America didn't lead through fear, but shared values

Yeah, this is way off.

I'm cool with some other country leading the free world tbh, America is a shitshow

I just got an email suggesting that if the US is withdrawing from Paris Accord others may follow. Would be the big worry right now, wouldn't it?

idk if other countries wanna follow the US's example right now

not gonna happen

Been thinking that America under trump has a lot of nerve thinking it's in any position to police the world.

So hope the idea that nobody wants to follow its lead is prevalent.

the biggest economies - China, India, Europe, etc. - are gonna stay in, they smell money.

Also I'm pretty sure if UK got woke and repealed Brexit the EU would welcome us back like the undeserving shitheel prodigal sons we are

― Who's puttin' sponge in the zings I once zung (stevie), Thursday, June 1, 2017 8:29 PM (one minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Without a shadow of a doubt. But admitting a mistake or u-turning on something is seen as the biggest crime a politician can make. So: so not gonna happen.

I wouldn't get too carried away with that admirational/aspirational thing.

I realize "beacon on the hill" is self-serving rhetoric, but I'm pretty sure the world would be a darker place had the Axis or USSR won. Elites around the world wanted to live in liberal democracies, because they were educated in the US (or UK). Globally, things got better, and global trade flourished, but the pace of change was perhaps too fast for the industrial and agricultural belts in the US. More should have been done to moderate the pace, provide safety nets, and ensure that all the benefits didn't flow to those directing capital flows.

I just got an email suggesting that if the US is withdrawing from Paris Accord others may follow. Would be the big worry right now, wouldn't it?

― Stevolende, Thursday, June 1, 2017 8:39 PM (two minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Find that hard to believe. Trump basically gave China a golden opportunity, on a silver platter, to join the 'sensible' nations and say: 'we aren't following this nation in decline with an idiot for prez but instead are joining the ranks of nations who want to do good'. And they would be otm.

Without a shadow of a doubt. But admitting a mistake or u-turning on something is seen as the biggest crime a politician can make. So: so not gonna happen.

― Le Bateau Ivre, Thursday, June 1, 2017 9:41 PM (one minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I think if business wants it enough or the pain of it happening is so great it will kill the party responsible, a way of u-turning without admitting the mistake and taking credit for it somehow might be thrown together. /wishful thinking

brexit/Trump have, I sense, given the rest of the world a sense that the UK/Us are kind of sick and messed up places at the moment and no one really wants to follow their lead as brexit/trump both seem pretty catastrophic mistakes, both morally and financially

yup

Well yeah with you there (though also on the /wishfulthinking part). It killing the party (parties) responsible would be a dream come true but that's just too much to wish for tbh.

xp

re Watergate

I'm talking in terms of the electorate themselves

Nixon's craven sliminess, particularly once the tapes came out, was no longer deniable to anyone but the zealots. Woody Allen once said, "In my (early '50s) high school, everyone knew Nixon was a crook."

As the maxim goes, it was the coverup, not the initial crimes.

Alfred is correct, there's no Dem majorities and no responsible wing of the GOP.

Worth mentioning that the "only the US, Nicaragua and Syria aren't part of the Paris Accord" is off base because Nicaragua didn't sign because they thought the accord didn't go far enough - they're apparently on track to be 90 percent renewable energy by 2020. So it's really just Trump and Assad.

Nixon had had to try to explain having accepted the dog Checkers back in 52 way before he got the Presidency. So why did he get the presidency. I need to read that bio I got of him a couple of months back.

brexit/Trump have, I sense, given the rest of the world a sense that the UK/Us are kind of sick and messed up places at the moment and no one really wants to follow their lead as brexit/trump both seem pretty catastrophic mistakes, both morally and financially

― Who's puttin' sponge in the zings I once zung (stevie), Thursday, June 1, 2017 8:46 PM (three minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This is really otm imho. Seeing how enemies Merkel and Schulz are battling it out in the German elections, yet Schulz actually sticking up for Merkel becz Trump gave her and Germany shit... It is quite something. I don't think there are more than five countries in the world right now who'd point to the UK/US and say: "Yes, this path is something we should embrace and follow."

Same with China following suit on the accords now, which I think is a very good thing for the climate, but politically they just had to tap in the ball into an open goal: Trump makes a fool of the US, so very very easy for China to gain at least some standing, in other words: profit. They profit from Trump's stupidity. A lot of nations and politicians, for better or worse, will try to do this.

"A warm-up band introduced Trump by playing the George Gershwin classic 'Summertime'."

turnin' up the heat

re: global American hegemony/leadership - the jig was pretty much up after the Iraq War, this is just the nail in the coffin. We may be the only country that can globally project military power, but that counts for less and less these days.

http://i.imgur.com/JXkE7pD.jpg

lol

Clinton blames her data team for election loss. Data team leader tweets (see images), then, mysteriously, deleted them. pic.twitter.com/NFE1QvdIcx

— Jacob Matthew Dix (@Jacob606) June 1, 2017

So yeah, some of the finer points of detail re: Flynn or Sessions are new, and the Comey twist is new, but there was enough to go on before the election. People. Do. Not. Give. A. Shit.

The Flynn, Comey and Sessions news that have come out in the last month are bombshells! Not fine details imho. And more importantly: he's in office now and liable for things like obstruction of justice (or, in the court of public opinion, the appearance of it). At the risk of being Pollyanna-ish, I think it matters that he so obviously fumbles all denials and everyone in his administration looks and acts like they're carrying out a sloppy and incompetent coverup.

But as for "people" not caring, Trump's approval numbers make clear that something has worn him down from his already unprecedentedly bad numbers. Maybe it's not the investigations at all; it seems likely that the healthcare debacle was damaging with the general public, and more generally maybe it's the failure to do everything he promised. But this is all related! The fact that his White House is under constant investigation and he sucks at making that go away damages these efforts. That might not be the same as people "giving a shit" about Mike Flynn directly, but I'll take it.

As the Mayor of Pittsburgh, I can assure you that we will follow the guidelines of the Paris Agreement for our people, our economy & future. https://t.co/3znXGTcd8C

— bill peduto (@billpeduto) June 1, 2017

Where Pittsburgh goes, so goes the world.

I still can't get over how incoherent that speech was. If you didn't know what he was talking about you'd think US signed an agreement to literally deliver billions of dollars to Paris. Then he talks about making a climate deal with the Democrats (!??). So much stupidity to unpack.

Nixon's craven sliminess, particularly once the tapes came out, was no longer deniable to anyone but the zealots.

Are there more zealots now? Because Russia, etc, aside - if it is a thing, and I know it was 'out there' before the election, but it seems much more vivid with each passing day - audio evidence of Trump's crave sliminess compelled thousands to revel in the whole deplorable thing.

It was no https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51oKpntKtOL._SY346_.jpg or https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51YUpRjmRHL._SY346_.jpg.

xpost to Dr. C, but do his approval numbers mean anything at all? He could have 0% approval and be just as destructive until congress stands up to him en masse. And there are still plenty of people in congress who are waaaaaay more than mere supporters, people like Nunes or Gomer Pyle or whomever, who are actively acting on behalf of the admin.

Like I said, let's see how things go in 2018, let alone 2020. If things don't go Dem, then no, no one gives a shit. Not really.

BREAKING: France, Germany, Italy issue joint statement saying Paris climate accord can't be renegotiated.

— The Associated Press (@AP) June 1, 2017

This can only mean one thing: US declares War on Europe!

Deafening silence from the UK I note.

compelled thousands to revel in the whole deplorable thing.

just the other evening i was having a drink at a local happy hour and this nice looking senior citizen was waiting for her friend to arrive so she can present her with the Adorable Deplorable matching bracelets she got. UGH i wanted to punch those old bitches after about 3 mins

Dead soon enough. Or hey, at this rate, maybe even sooner!

Has anyone yet proposed a march on Washington culminating in collective vomiting? Like, through the fence onto WH lawn?

The Petudo tweet is a good reminder there is lots of UN (and, oddly, Vatican) stuff on sustainability, global warming and urbanisation working directly with mayors and bypassing national governments. Hopefully cities across the US will be falling over themselves to fill the void of moral leadership.

I'm pretty conscious that my shock at the whole 'deplorable' thing is in itself a symptom of my own white privilege, that it shocks me that people would so unashamedly revel in their racism and homophobia and so on.

My favourite part:

"As someone who cares deeply about the environment, which I do, I cannot, in good conscience, support a deal that punishes the United States: the world's leader in environmental protection."

"The United States, under the Trump administration, will continue to be the cleanest and most environmentally friendly country on earth, we're gonna be the cleanest, we're gonna have the cleanest air, we're gonna have the cleanest water."

"but do his approval numbers mean anything at all?"

You brought up people "not giving a shit" and I tried to find some metric of measuring how much of a shit people might possibly give...? Also FYI the country is brutally gerrymandered and suffering from growing voter suppression efforts by the Republicans so I don't think the 2018 results really present a final determination on whether "people give a shit."

But if you want to get into whether approval numbers "mean anything" in the sense of "mattering," I would say, yes, they do. A President that is massively popular has an easier time accomplishing things in Congress than a President that is massively unpopular. As I've rambled about before on these threads, when the President is constantly screwing up and walking into scandals and clumsily defending himself against really serious charges, it gets harder to get a legislative agenda - there are only so many hours in a day and they're going to the wrong things. It was purple-district Republicans, plus a solid blue wall, that killed Trumpcare 1.0 a couple months ago - so for whatever you do next, you need to win some of them over, convince them that voting for this thing won't kill them with their constituents back home. If you're massively popular, that's easy - they run on "I stood with the massively popular president." If you're massively unpopular, it's going to need more work because they're thinking "my god, these town halls are eating me alive, everybody was already fuming about your awful health care plan and now there's a viral video of me getting sonned hardcore by a senior citizen demanding a Russia investigation." There's going to need to be a lot of meetings with these legislators. You and your staff are going to have to dedicate lunches to wheedling, arm-twisting, deal-cutting, wearing down their doubts, pointing to your internal research that suggests the legislation is actually more popular than it seems, whatever.

But oops, now all your time is spent meeting with lawyers and hunkering down with the inner circle of mutual paranoia, ranting about leakers and enemies in the press. While you do that, your more competent staff are devoting what should be arm-twisting time to coming up with today's cover story for yesterday's awful revelation, and trying to propagate it to your surrogates to use on TV. Said surrogates, including the congresspeople who are unreservedly for the bill, are devoting their TV airtime to defending the massively unpopular, scandal-ridden President, and they're doing it badly because a) it's pretty indefensible and b) your dysfunctional White House can't even devote itself to the spin-doctoring of your competent staff because you tweeted out a totally different story twenty minutes ago.

Obviously there are still lots of awful things he can do (will do, is doing) but American legislative politics don't just run on autopilot in between elections... the things that happen and the popularity of politicians matter as the story unfolds.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DBQtw8DWAAA4ptb.jpg

macron just addressed france and said we must "make the planet great again" (lolz?)

I have rarely seen a purely political move confessed as being such. They have no choice but to sandbag the dam.

— Richard M. Nixon (@dick_nixon) June 1, 2017

Would Bush or Rubio have done this?

Probably not? They also lost!

And like, actually lost, not "won by negative three million people"

I don't think they would have either. The timing of this is so arbitrary -- it's a completely gratuitous tantrum.

I confess to not understanding the apparently monumental nature of pulling out of the Paris Accord.

We will re-enter as early as 2021; in the intervening time, private investment will still turn more and more to sustainable sources, and at this point no amount of renewable green anything is anything more than a tourniquet; some kind of technological reversal solution is the only likely way to save life as we know it anyway.

BUT this is still the kind of thing the GOP will get behind en masse.

Sorry self xp

not really. only 22 GOP Senators signed that stupid letter

xp

and majorities in EVERY STATE support staying in the agreement

yep

http://climatecommunication.yale.edu/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/Politics-and-Global-Warming-November-2016-01.png

he doesn't even pretend to be the president of all of us

he is only the president of everyone's stupid uncle who posts that dumb shit on facebook

But those coal miners are clinking their oxygen tanks together in toasts tonight!

this is so demented

Imagine if Trump visited a coal mine and it collapsed on him? That would be a fitting end.

I confess to not understanding the apparently monumental nature of pulling out of the Paris Accord.

We will re-enter as early as 2021; in the intervening time, private investment will still turn more and more to sustainable sources, and at this point no amount of renewable green anything is anything more than a tourniquet; some kind of technological reversal solution is the only likely way to save life as we know it anyway.

― El Tomboto, Thursday, June 1, 2017 6:21 PM (nine minutes ago) Bookmark

agree

it's what it represents, innit? the sheer old-fart fuck-you nihilism.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DBRO6srWAAEmm_b.jpg

Silver lining: maybe it's almost time to start the Anglo-American Cultural Supremacy into the shitbin thread

or wait did we do that already and it was about something funny ha-ha instead of the actual wagon wheel going into history's mud

even if we end up going down some hail mary geo-engineering path, that will require global cooperation. even then, lowering emissions will still need to be a part of addressing climate change. it's insane for america to be the one country to try to undermine global solidarity on this issue.

Is this how we get to the utopian star trek future?

Silver lining: maybe it's almost time to start the Anglo-American Cultural Supremacy into the shitbin thread

It won't go down without a fight.

Agree with tb and Chinese symbol

Stevie, what dyou think wouldn't it be better all round just to ignore the old fuckers symbolism, it's ugly and all and obviously his having garnered enough pustules with voting rights to occupy the position is troubling but even moves as showily malevolent as this won't in the medium run achieve anything much at all

Good yanks just need to stay alive and healthy until 2018, and hope that whatever momentum the tea party at al managed to get up while Obama was in office will well and truly have worn off by that stage.

Yes. It is also insane to have a democracy that elects the less popular leader because "them's the rules!"

Nothing sane about democracy tbf

I wouldn't let a randomly selected quorum pick a fucking sandwich

we're a democracy that enshrined the rights of a minority of white supremacists into our founding document, an error which we will never stop paying for

So many xps on xps. Not following my own Zing pro tips

Sorry to stick with this people don't give a shit thought. I know I am reducing things, but I can only assume the vast majority of the millions that didn't vote did not do so because they were gerrymandered or otherwise restricted, they did it because they didn't care or didn't care to bother. I understand that by any reasonable metric Trump has been doing a terrible job and has terrible support, but by any reasonable metric he should not be president either.

xp:
Technically, geoengineering doesn't require cooperation, just persistence. A squadron of jet fighters with 20km+ ceilings could deposit enough sulfur aerosols, but they have to do it for roughly 500-1000 years, til 60% of emissions are dissolved in the oceans. Skip a few years, the albedo falls to normal and everyone experiences abrupt extreme climate change.

Josh, we all agree with you.

The fact that anybody would vote Republican in this climate, and therefore tacitly endorse whatever Trump is doing, is sign enough that even if people do give a shit, millions upon millions of them give a shit about enacting horrible horrible policies. Which frankly is the not the kind of civic engagement I find hopeful. Like, re Russia, even if people are disturbed a huge hunk of them aren't disturbed enough to consider it more important than all the horrible things they want him to do. Given how terribly destroying the ACA or dropping out of the climate Accord poll, I don't even know what these people want from Trump.

Sorry, readily admit I am just ranting. Need to vent, so thanks for whatever patience you can afford me.

Technically, geoengineering doesn't require cooperation, just persistence. A squadron of jet fighters with 20km+ ceilings could deposit enough sulfur aerosols, but they have to do it for roughly 500-1000 years, til 60% of emissions are dissolved in the oceans. Skip a few years, the albedo falls to normal and everyone experiences abrupt extreme climate change.

― it's just locker room treason (Sanpaku), Thursday, June 1, 2017 6:52 PM (five minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Jesus Christ

Trump is like some idiot who promised to eat glass. And when everybody tells him, no, you don't have to eat glass, he says, I'm sorry, a promise is a promise.

Am departing presidential councils. Climate change is real. Leaving Paris is not good for America or the world.

— Elon Musk (@elonmusk) June 1, 2017

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FjWe31S_0g

nah, trump is the guy who enforces the promise to eat glass on the idiot who agreed to it. then everybody's like "hey, it's ok. he doesn't really have to eat the glass" trump buckles down and insists that he must eat the glass.

imo

And then he eats glass himself anyway.

i never hated anyone so much

he is making us eating the glass, rather.

"trump makes us eat the glass while pruitt tonguefucks his ass", and 12 other family friendly songs, by gerald freedom with the true american patriot orchestra

Hitler lived when global population was 2 billion, and competed with Stalin. Trump may in fact become the most hated living person.

is this where somebody's supposed to say but the emails?

but HER emails

good one tho

naomi klein:

NOW THAT IT SEEMS virtually certain that Donald Trump will withdraw the United States from the Paris climate accord, and the climate movement is quite rightly mobilizing in the face of this latest dystopian lurch, it’s time to get real about something: Pretty much everything that is weak, disappointing, and inadequate about that deal is the result of U.S. lobbying since 2009.

The fact that the agreement only commits governments to keeping warming below an increase of 2 degrees, rather than a much safer firm target of 1.5 degrees, was lobbied for and won by the United States.

The fact that the agreement left it to individual nations to determine how much they were willing to do to reach that temperature target, allowing them to come to Paris with commitments that collectively put us on a disastrous course toward more than 3 degrees of warming, was lobbied for and won by the United States.

The fact that the agreement treats even these inadequate commitments as non-binding, which means governments apparently do not have anything to fear if they ignore their commitments, is something else that was lobbied for and won by the United States.

The fact that the agreement specifically prohibits poor countries from seeking damages for the costs of climate disasters was lobbied for and won by the United States.

The fact that it is an “agreement” or an “accord” and not a treaty — the very thing that makes it possible for Trump to stage his action-movie slow-mo walk away, world in flames behind him — was lobbied for and won by the United States.

hilarious, in that context, to consider this part of trump's speech:

Even if the Paris Agreement were implemented in full, with total compliance from all nations, it is estimated it would only produce a 2/10 of one degree – think of that. This much….Celsius reduction in global temperature by the year 2100. Tiny tiny amount.

http://www.npr.org/2017/06/01/531090243/trumps-speech-on-paris-climate-agreement-withdrawal-annotated

Sorry to stick with this people don't give a shit thought. I know I am reducing things, but I can only assume the vast majority of the millions that didn't vote did not do so because they were gerrymandered or otherwise restricted, they did it because they didn't care or didn't care to bother. I understand that by any reasonable metric Trump has been doing a terrible job and has terrible support, but by any reasonable metric he should not be president either.

Generally speaking, it's not good enough to vote against something (France excepted). You need to actually be promoting something worth believing in to get people to give a shit, and be at least semi-credible while doing it.

It's telling that even with Le Pen running there was still 33.4% abstention when it came to that or voting for a centrist

did he say 2/10 because is sounded smaller than 1/5?

he likes to divide everything up into tens because it's easier to visualize using his fingers

we're a democracy that enshrined the rights of a minority of white supremacists into our founding document, an error which we will never stop paying for

― Οὖτις, Thursday, June 1, 2017 10:46 PM (one hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

we're also the only democracy on the planet that still uses a constitution from the 18th century

Nicaraguan businessman friend: "A group of us will ask Ortega to sign Paris Accord. Being in same group w/Trump is so damn embarrassing."

— Ana Navarro (@ananavarro) June 1, 2017

Russian environmentalists brand U.S. Green Party Putin 'accomplices'

Oops, a bit dated, that.

Jesus, EVERYTHING i read in the paper now is reminding me of Trump and Bannon...

"Astronomers said Thursday that they had felt space-time vibrations known as gravitational waves from the merger of a pair of mammoth black holes resulting in a pit of infinitely deep darkness weighing as much as 49 suns, some 3 billion light-years from here."

my (endangered) congressman:

The effects of pollution and climate change do not obey national or continental borders. This us vs them mentality makes 0 sense.

— Carlos Curbelo (@carloslcurbelo) June 1, 2017

That 2/10 bit was what I heard on NPR, I think I screamed obscenities and immediately afterward had a car nearly crash into me. I think unrelated but maybe the driver was just trying to help.

As long as the defensive ring of accomplices are like 5-deep, I dig this:

Hundreds came together to support #IftarInTheStreets in #NYC this evening in front of Trump Tower. #Ramadan2017 pic.twitter.com/Mw2LuixhIn

— Kyle O'Leary (@tkocreative) June 2, 2017

Silver lining: maybe it's almost time to start the Anglo-American Cultural Supremacy into the shitbin thread

It won't go down without a fight.

― pomenitul

anglo-american supremacy will die like anglo-americans: shitting itself and cursing incoherently at the nursemaids assigned to care for it.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/inside-trumps-climate-decision-after-fiery-debate-he-stayed-where-hes-always-been/2017/06/01/e4acb27e-46db-11e7-bcde-624ad94170ab_story.html

so basically he went with his gut and also hates macron, that's pretty much it

i am hung up on a moment early on where the reporter describes bannon as working feverishly to pull together tons of material to make the case against the agreement. i feel like we need another word besides "work" to describe the effort it takes to spend many many hours preparing information that is misleading and inaccurate

Frank Luntz could probably think of a good one, he's good at that kind of thing

if i had Soros money i'd start paying for white evangelical scalps

so beating him at the handshake was bad strategy?

Macron shakes his hand too hard - shit list. Comey too tall - shit list.

won the hand battle, lost the hand war

So I was right about him outdoing the title twattery within about a day. Wonder what he's got for us tomorrow.
But I guess should be used to that by now. Earthquake country.

Macron public adress manages to both piss off the ex-french presidents who couldn't speak english and do absolutely everything it can to rile up Trump. I'm down.

Another, smaller contingent tried for an outside-the-box fix: Marc Short, Trump’s director of legislative affairs, argued that the climate pact could be considered a treaty, in which case the president should send it to the Senate, which would need to ratify it by a two-thirds majority. Chief of Staff Reince Priebus and Nick Ayers, a senior strategist for Vice President Pence, both supported the idea. But it never gained much traction because the agreement was specifically crafted as an agreement that did not need Senate ratification.

Uh
gallows humor but looooooooooooooool

This is also quite interesting ... https://t.co/hWhd3anQRl pic.twitter.com/cGMB9QC8dF

— Josh Marshall (@joshtpm) June 2, 2017

this is a tweet by josh marshall saying "this is also quite interesting..." with a cartoon of josh marshall looking down at a piece of josh marshall's writing which concludes "that's interesting"

13/ That's interesting.

— Josh Marshall (@joshtpm) June 2, 2017

so beating him at the handshake was bad strategy?

i thought it was the appropriate way to deal with the situation. trump was going to quit the climate agreement regardless. why? he feels bad about it. why? 'paris' + 'climate' + 'agreement' are words that make him feel bad, so you put them together, and he feels like it's bad. his feelings are very important. a lot of men in charge are like this

yep.

http://www.sierraclub.org/compass/2017/06/10-things-you-can-do-resist-trump-s-historic-paris-mistake

i was reading an article earlier on how the sierra club's beyond coal campaign has quietly been tremendously effective - 250+ coal power plants in the us retired/committed to retire.

my hope is that at the end of the day the biggest actual effect of this action (i understand the actual agreement withdrawal cannot even happen until nov 4, 2020) will be further energizing activists and damage politically to trump/GOP. bannon thinking this is a win like kushner thought firing comey was a win

i appreciate your optimism (seriously)

Frankly, the low costs/BTU of fracked NG since 2009 have been far more effective than any environmental groups in driving utilities to retire coal and embrace combined cycle NG, which is the current solution to the renewables intermittancy problem as well. That will continue (so long as dumb shareholders/creditors subsidize NG) for a while, regardless of Trump's idiocy.

cnn panel like every cnn panel has approx 2 people who have facts and expertise and then 2 people who are political hacks and don't know anything about the subject and have them discuss, like this is a reasonable way to cover the news. christ. stephen moore and jeffrey lord and that casey anthony trump lady or whatever her name is are on tv constantly and melissa harris-perry doesn't have a show

we're also the only democracy on the planet that still uses a constitution from the 18th century

Can you imagine what the one "we" would write in the 21st century would look like?

If The U.S. weakened the terms of the Paris Accord is there any likelihood that in its absence the other members might make the terms stronger. & when America returns with its tail between its legs it'll be harder to get back out of?
Or is its presence for the next 4 years going to hinder that?

While the USA is still there, the rest should crank it up ludicrously and troll the US at every opportunity.

Macron has already started the trolling. Wasn't sure about that guy before.

i think macron secretly wants to literally rule the world. all the military stuff, his ludicrous statement that france hasn't had "a strong leader since napoleon" (senior, i presume).. his quite obvious attempt to seize the world leadership vacuum created by trump by giving a speech in english last night. jsl

Acting on your best behaviour
Turn your back on mother nature

macron macron what have ye done

we're also the only democracy on the planet that still uses a constitution from the 18th century

Can you imagine what the one "we" would write in the 21st century would look like?

― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, June 2, 2017 1:02 AM (six hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yeah I'd love to see what Ryan, McConnell and Trump cook up for Bill of Rights 2.0

A few more republican governors/state legislatures and you might get your constitutional convention wish...

http://wuwm.com/post/wisconsin-could-become-30th-state-demand-constitutional-convention

It takes 34 to convene and draft an Amendment, 38 for a convention.

Number of Republican governors: 33

*blows raspberry*

thanks, didn't realize we were still 5 away

On the other hand, it's just a rule. Or a law, or whatever. People increasingly just do whatever they feel regardless of some dumb code of conduct. Maybe the president will just smash open the case where the Constitution is and start writing some new amendments at the bottom in crayon. Why the fuck not.

i wonder how hard it would be to convince trump that the national treasure movies are documentaries

It's like releasing a wild dog in your kitchen and trusting that it'll behave like a person and also cook you a meal. Just give it a chance.

xpost If he's seen them, he probably doesn't even need convincing.

People are still out there putting forth the proposition that they should 'just give him a chance' aren't they?
Do they have a default switch off point?

Well yeah, we all do; it's called "death"

People are still out there putting forth the proposition that they should 'just give him a chance' aren't they?

yeah, i hear this a lot from trump's faithful. they support (or at least shruggingly accept) everything he does & think the "msm" are liberal crybabies on a vengeful witch hunt.

Well yeah, we all do; it's called "death"

speak for yourself - i'm cursed to walk the earth forevermore

xp yeah and the "if they would just let him do his thing" argument, the narrative that he is being hamstrung by the swamp/deep state is already being constructed

Someone in my office was making that argument a couple of weeks ago--admittedly a perhaps not-too-swift twenty-something from Staten Island, so he's a nice boy but I wouldn't set too much store by his opinions if it weren't for the fact that he gets to vote.

"we woulda won in vietnam"

the whole fucking point of a congress is so a president can't "just do his thing"

and yet his supporters say Trump is right to pull out of this since it didn't go through Congress.

Trump pulls out of Paris Accord, stocks rise. Why isn't the end of civilization priced into the market?

— Scott Adams (@ScottAdamsSays) June 1, 2017

Too long term. What will it do to next quarter’s earnings? https://t.co/Wz8cz5WzFl

— Doug Henwood (@DougHenwood) June 1, 2017

markets dont act rational, fucko. just because people worship them doesn't mean they're right.

how can you be 60 years old and have not know that the long-term stability of environmental factors doesn't price into the stock market

you know whats also not priced into the market? people's well-being.

“Labor is being paid first again”: American Airlines investors complain after company gives pilots and flight attendants raises

http://www.salon.com/2017/04/28/labor-is-being-paid-first-again-american-airlines-investors-complain-after-company-gives-pilots-and-flight-attendants-raises/

Meanwhile:

Sen. Richard Burr (R-NC) on Thursday indicated that he’s not optimistic about the Senate’s chances to pass a comprehensive bill to repeal and replace Obamacare this year.

ADVERTISING

“I don’t see a comprehensive health-care plan this year,” he told North Carolina television station WXII 12 News.

Burr also said that the House bill is “dead on arrival” in the Senate.

The senator’s comments come after Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) said last week that he’s not sure how the Senate will pass an Obamacare repeal bill.

“I don’t know how we get to 50 at the moment,” he told Reuters. “But that’s the goal.”

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/burr-no-senate-health-plan-this-year

aaaand about that testimony:

President Donald Trump could invoke executive privilege to prevent fired FBI director James Comey from delivering his scheduled testimony before Congress next week, White House counselor Kellyanne Conway suggested Friday.

Conway first told ABC’s “Good Morning America” that the Trump team would be “watching with the rest of the world” to see what Comey said in his congressional testimony.

Then, asked directly if Trump would use his presidential authority to block Comey’s testimony, Conway hedged: “The President will make that decision.”

good luck w that

isn't that exactly what landed Nixon before the SC

DO IT, TRUMP!!!

yeah, do it!

I am so completely adamant about my innocence that I will do everything in my power to prevent the possibility of my official exoneration.

Meantime...

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-flynn-turkey-exclusive-idUSKBN18T276

Robert Mueller, the special counsel investigating possible ties between the Trump election campaign and Russia, is expanding his probe to include a grand jury investigation into former national security adviser Michael Flynn, three sources told Reuters.

The move means Mueller’s politically charged inquiry will now look into Flynn’s paid work as a lobbyist for a Turkish businessman in 2016, in addition to contacts between Russian officials and Flynn and other Trump associates during and after the Nov. 8 presidential election.

Federal prosecutors in Virginia are investigating a deal between Flynn and Turkish businessman Ekim Alptekin as part of a grand jury criminal probe, according to a subpoena seen by Reuters.

Alptekin’s company, Netherlands-based Inovo BV, paid Flynn's consultancy $530,000 between September and November to produce a documentary and research on Fethullah Gulen, an exiled Turkish cleric living in the United States. Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan blames Gulen for a failed coup last July.

Alptekin, an ally of Erdogan, told Reuters he hired Flynn to provide research on how Gulen is “poisoning the atmosphere” between Turkey and the United States.

Gulen has denied any role in the coup and dismisses Turkey’s allegations that he heads a terrorist organization.

Bernie interview:

Is Trump in his eyes an autocrat, or does he simply fail to understand the constitutional limits of the presidency? "The answer is both," Sanders replies. "I think he has authoritarian tendencies. The fact that he feels comfortable with authoritarians like Russian President Vladimir Putin, Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte and others around the world, suggests to me that he is an authoritarian-type personality." Trump, says Sanders, is also working "hand in glove" with the "billionaire class to move this country in a very oligarchic direction."...

The essence of his argument is that he doesn't want people to believe that (impeachment talk) is just a political attack on Trump and that he wants to bring Republicans along. "If Bernie Sanders says something, people say, 'Well, you don't like Donald Trump.'" That, he adds, is why it's a good thing that former FBI Director Robert Mueller has been appointed as special counsel. "You have somebody who a lot of people respect," says Sanders.

In his opinion, would the Democrats be making a mistake by focusing solely on Russia? If everything is about Russia, says Sanders, many people will say: "Hey, all of that is interesting, but you know what? I can't afford health care. I don't have a job. My kid can't afford to go to college. Why don't you pay attention to our needs?"

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/interview-with-bernie-sanders-about-donald-trump-a-1149427.html

the "if they would just let him do his thing" argument, the narrative that he is being hamstrung by the swamp/deep state is already being constructed

Forsooth; indeed it was thusly foretold before the election. Resistance on the part of entrenched elites was expected, and continually saying so is a common means of managing expectations. "It's going to take more than 100 days to dismantle an infrastructure of corruption dating back to the New Deal; jeez, guys."

If everything is about Russia, says Sanders, many people will say: "Hey, all of that is interesting, but you know what? I can't afford health care. I don't have a job. My kid can't afford to go to college. Why don't you pay attention to our needs?"

otmfm, Bernie

the biggest problem is that the dems have a valid excuse for not passing helpful legislation, bcz they don't have control of the House, the Senate, or the Presidency, but the same people bernie cites above as asking those questions will not accept even valid excuses. this is why somebody in the dems needs to think about a gingrich-style 'contract with america' in lieu of the fact that no one pays attention to party platforms any more. it needs to be specific and it needs to be simple for voters to grasp.

I feel like a juicy newsbomb has dropped every Friday around COB for the last few weeks, so I'm gonna be pretty disappointed if it doesn't happen again today.

i could use a break tbh

leakers gonna leak

and the tweakers gonna tweak tweak tweak

The president told mainline Protestant pastors he did great with evangelicals. Then asked if they were Christian. https://t.co/XghYKhQxIc pic.twitter.com/g4JrOvbYhP

— Daniel Dale (@ddale8) June 2, 2017

"I see you have two eyes, a mouth. Are you some sort of dog? Or a bird, maybe?"

In his opinion, would the Democrats be making a mistake by focusing solely on Russia?

I guess that would be a mistake if ... it were even remotely a possible thing Democrats might do? In fact there seems to be a swarm in all directions, besides Russia a constant stream of "GOP is trying to take away your health insurance" + "Trump is an incompetent idiot whose only policy goal is to be flattered" + "give money to this special election candidate" and "Trump doesn't think climate change is real" etc. and etc. I think they're doing a good job keeping a lot of balls in the air and they're doing a good job focusing on the many aspects in which Trump admin's priorities are broadly unpopular

Yeah I don't know anyone whose only beef with Trump is Russiastuff.

It's more like, hit him on all fronts with whatever ammunition comes to hand.

That he's so committed to giving people more reasons to think there's something fishy there (re Russia) is on him.

CNN and MSNBC seem to be covering Russia more than is warranted, and the right has managed to equate those networks with the Democratic Party, so that may explain some of that thinking. I was flipping between the two last night while waiting for the Finals to start and there was plenty of Russia talk even though Paris really should have been the only story.

from what I've read and heard, actual Democratic candidates like Quist and Ossof seem to be wisely leaning very heavy on health care in making their case.

obvs. Quist is past tense now.

Brett Stephens hire was a++++++ NYT... =|

another good one from der spiegel

http://cdn3.spiegel.de/images/image-1149622-640_panofree-qfwb-1149622.jpg

I guess that would be a mistake if ... it were even remotely a possible thing Democrats might do? In fact there seems to be a swarm in all directions, besides Russia a constant stream of "GOP is trying to take away your health insurance" + "Trump is an incompetent idiot whose only policy goal is to be flattered" + "give money to this special election candidate" and "Trump doesn't think climate change is real" etc. and etc. I think they're doing a good job keeping a lot of balls in the air and they're doing a good job focusing on the many aspects in which Trump admin's priorities are broadly unpopular

This is all well and good but at some point they're gonna need to do better in their own platform than "15$ min wage in eight years" (lol) if they want anyone to actually show up

or as Jon Schwarz put it last October

Democrats: "Nothing's free kids we'll never have free healthcare or free college or a living wage or hey how did Trump become president"

— Jon Schwarz (@tinyrevolution) February 20, 2016

make that 2/16

they're gonna need to do better in their own platform than "15$ min wage in eight years" (lol) if they want anyone to actually show up

Why? Trump had nothing except "I'm not like those liberal pansies", and he beat 15 Republicans and a Democrat.

I mean, he did say "everything will be great for you and everyone will have well-paying jobs and be rich and everything will be free," I guess, but he was just lying, but the point can't be "Democrats should lie more," can it?

its pretty safe to say that trump's administration has shattered the belief that lying has consequences

Have you read the Democratic Party's platform?

https://www.democrats.org/party-platform

Has anyone?

Yeah, their "reign in Wall Street" angle is super credible.

https://www.rt.com/usa/378616-dnc-votes-corporate-lobby-money/

I guess i'm not sure what point you're making, DJP; is the point that Dem candidates should be talking more loudly about the policy stuff in that platform? To a first approximation it looks pretty similar to what I hear them saying: rich people should pay their share, women should have rights, etc.

oh and the health care language in their platform is bullshit

Trump had his wall with mexico, paid for by mexico. He had his muslim ban and killing the families of isis fighters. He had his bullshit promises about fabulous healthcare for everyone to replace obamacare. He had pulling out of nafta, tpp, and the paris climate accord, and naming china a currency manipulator. Trump had his list of anti-abortion supreme court nominees.

Trump's positions were crap piled on crap as high as he could reach, but they were often very specific, acted like catnip for his base, and he repeated them over and over in simple, clear language.

Why do you think the health care language in their platform is bullshit?

are these guys gonna amount to something or nah? http://www.peoplescoalition.us/peoples-coalition/

For all the niceties about "health care being a right", major establishment Dems like Clinton and Pelosi have actively stated that true universal health care isn't one of the party's goals and/or is never gonna happen. Universal care (as opposed to "universal access") is still, from what I can tell, a fringe goal w/in the party, though hopefully that's changing due to sheer public outrage. xp

Your objection, then, is that health care should be free and the Democratic party does not support that? Or am I misunderstanding you?

Is Trump most useful as a reagent?
Seems to be causing a lot of reactions that might actually eventually get something more positive done.

Er, yeah? xp

("Free" as in paid for by the state, of course, nothing's free)

every day i try to look for positive patterns in all this, like maybe Comey's testimony will knock him down. Or Kushner will get charged with something and flip on his father in law. Or that McKinley had a secretary named Trump and vice versa.

Not even Nordic countries has 'true universal health care', btw.

Trump's campaign holding a 'Pittstburgh not Paris' rally. At Lafayette square. That's dumb.

every day i try to look for positive patterns in all this, like maybe Comey's testimony will knock him down. Or Kushner will get charged with something and flip on his father in law. Or that McKinley had a secretary named Trump and vice versa.

― nomar,

Make arrests. Stir the shitstorm.

Stare into the tv static looking for patterns all you like. In the end, you'll only wind up getting sucked into some paranormal nethervoid in your bedroom closet.

thread here

Is this the time for me to leak the gossip I know about Melania Trump or should I wait. (And I'm serious btw.)

— Monica Byrne (@monicabyrne13) June 1, 2017

tl;dr Donnie is a literal cuck