ILX Parenting 5: I'm a big kid now

Vicky gave us a Mei Tai - http://www.meitaibaby.com/ - when our first was born: probably the most useful piece of baby kit we've had, we're now using it with daughter no. 2.

my daughter hated the sling, was definitely not okay with it. ergo worked out much better. diff strokes for diff strokes

also lol @ Euler's stoner analogy

diff folks!

we need a babysitter next weekend, enbb, can you come to colorado.

― tylerw, Thursday, March 8, 2012 2:11 PM (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

wait I can. on vacation, need to go skiing. I have several backpacks that can fit a babby, and I am p sure that being in the backcountry is good for young branes

I will accept bootlegs as payment

Vicky is some kind of abnormal genius who can just use, like, a long piece of stretchy fabric with no discernible purpose and end up with a happy baby, safely attached to her person. But she can also suggest "gateway slings" for everyone else.

babysitting payment is three bootlegs an hour, which i believe is colorado state minimum wage. sound good?

u have a deal

overtime must be paid entirely in neil youngs and/or feelies

A friend of mine makes her own Mei Tais and says they're amazing.

That Mei Tais in general are amazing not that the ones she makes are even more so or anything.

I have this!
http://www.myergobabycarrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/detail-2.jpg

I like when babies get worn on the front facing out and they're just sorta hanging around, watching the world. It cracks me up.

yeah, or it looks like the baby is actually controlling the adult.

yeah the Becco is somewhat similar to that ergobaby thing. Plus it looks like a flak jacket so I can be all badass and dadass at the same time.

http://filmwad.com/fw_images/2007/10/12/kuato.jpg

xp

haw, yes. not quite as gross as that, but that's the general idea.

ENBB- Raising six one day old baby chicks is probably the closest I ever got to caring for a newborn. I didn't want them to die on me. They ate pretty frequently and a lot so I was constantly filling their feeder, checking on them through the night, and they did have certain peeps for hunger and for being too cold, too hot. Regulating their temperature was scary, didn't want to cook them, didn't want them to die from being too cold.

One got very ill. I was up all night on a work night trying to keep her from dying on me. I nursed her back to health, no one else got ill either.

There was this satisfaction the first time I was able to take them outside. That night I kept looking out the window to make sure they wouldn't attract raccoons. Didn't want to come this far and wake up to a murder scene. The whole experience, I feel, did something for me. Maybe I am too sensitive or just nuts but it really did. I feel more prepared for a human baby than if I never cared for anything so tiny and fragile before.

A few years later I had to free a chick from it's shell and that was scary. One wrong move and they can bleed to death. Having a tiny, wet, newborn baby chick was a whole other 24 hour experience. She imprinted on me and that was attachment parenting-extreme. Could not leave her alone for even a second or she would screech her head off. The older chickens wanted nothing to with her and she didn't seem to know what the hell they were. Once Monday came around I took off a day from work and got her a sister from the feed store, problem solved.

ergo 4 lyfe

so comfortable

I don't look on here for a few weeks and look what happens! Congrats on the birth of Keren Hurting,and congrats Tera and JS, and BLAM!

So yes, slings! I love em, whatever your parenting 'philosophy. Handy to get around on public transport, wander in the countryside, give cuddles when you want to be getting on with something else, and really come into their own when you're on child #2 and child #1 needs some attention.

www.slingguide.co.uk is a really good guide to all the available types of sling out there, how to choose, how to use, where to buy (in the UK) etc. I don't believe that there is a 'best' sling, just the one that suits the parent and the baby at that particular time. I love wraps but I've used mei tais, ring sling, and soft structured carrier (e.g. an ergo, basically a buckle carrier)

People often get scared of the prices, but hey, you're carrying your child in there, and they hold their value REALLY well. If you buy second hand you can usually get back what you paid for it. They come up on Craiglist, ebay etc. and there's a large forum based in the US www.thebabywearer.com though it is a bit intimidatingly big and anachronistic for newbies.

Wraps are the most scary, but the best birth - pre-schooler carrier, imo. They have a steep learning curve but once you've got it you're away.

From newborn snuggles, through babyhood, toddlerhood into pre-schooler years, wherever you go.

http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6040/5902013655_af341de465.jpg
agave 3 by vickyp, on Flickr

http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6199/6085930686_de0a847902.jpg
IMG_2063 by vickyp, on Flickr

http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4132/4843484727_1c4ab6345f.jpg
Untitled by vickyp, on Flickr

If I had to be labelled then I'm sure I'd be labelled an attached parent. We're definitely going more that way than with Aidan, though some people might think we were pretty 'hippy' with him. We just did what we felt was best for him and us. There's no right or wrong way, you do the amount of reading that you think you need to do and you go with what you think makes sense, and you adjust if you feel you need to. The things we're doing differently second time around were/are homebirth, co-sleeping, totally babywearing not using a pram/buggy (that's more because it's easier for me, Molly and Aidan, rather than because a book told me it was what I should be doing). Things that we've done the same, BF on demand, self weaning, baby led weaning with solids, no smacking.

The changes we've made have their plus points and negative points. I have started to feel touched out at times (Molly's almost 9 months) and I want to get my evenings back so we're going to use the No Sleep Solution to start getting her to sleep on her own in the evenings, rather than being on my lap/boob downstairs until our bedtime. But as I said no way is perfect, you can't live your life how it was before children, it will never be the same and compromises have to be made whichever way you decide to parent.

No smacking?

But yes I am remiss in congratulating the Big Loud Mountain Ape! And *tera (still impending, right?)

Yeah the only downside of the Ergo is that it can't really be used for the first 3-4 months. They sell an "infant insert" that didn't really work well in our experience. But god every other carrier we tried was either massively uncomfortable or just sort of a pain to get on and off. Agreed completely about how useful they are with baby #2, when you need to be mobile and have both hands free for dealing with whatever nonsense #1 is getting up to. If you get a good one it'll last through both kids (or more?) so you're talking years of use. (Add all that time up, and think about what that time is doing to your back, and it's worth getting one that's comfortable/doesn't dig into your neck/etc). That said vickyp and I both live in one of the walkin'-est cities there is; maybe if you lived in Chattanooga a sling wouldn't be such an essential thing.

my kindergartner took huge exception to being SBd to her room last night. after about 20 minutes of howling protest (it was her big brother's fault) she asked for paper, which we allowed. 5 minutes later, she wordlessly delivered this note to the dinner table and returned to her room:

http://i486.photobucket.com/albums/rr222/Chass3ur/IMG_2268.jpg

kindergartener- spelling is a core family strength apparently

lol, smiley face after the signature is the kicker.

Those photos are great Vicky! Thanks for the websites too! I'm interested in hearing about your home birthing experience. If you wouldn't mind sharing?

lol initially misread that note as "wish I could have a beer"

omg that note

Can you pls help decipher though?

Lonely wish I could have a better . . . family?!

lol

aw

Passive aggressive notes

fwiw, around age 6 I once told my parents "I hate you, and if you get a divorce, it will be the happiest day of my life!" over some perceived slight that I have long forgotten.

EEK, Hurting...lol

You should tell Katie she HAD a better family, but due to a terrible miscommunication they left her at a highway rest stop outside Toledo with no identifying items and you could never find them again.

lol initially misread that note as "wish I could have a beer"

― the sir edmund hillary of sitting through pauly shore films (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, March 9, 2012 12:12 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

ditto

Such a hilarious note! Aidan's doing phonics at school and his spelling demonstrates just how wack spelling in the English Language is.

Tracer, is that a 'you don't hit your children?' or 'what the hell is smacking?!'

I don't mind sharing about the homebirth at all, but I think the arrangement was much easier here than for anyone in the US (I'm in the UK, London to be precise) In a lot of ways the actual birth was very similar to my first birth. I was lucky enough to be in our local midwife led birth centre at our nearest hospital and I had a straightforward waterbirth. Long labour and I spent a long time at home before going in. I spent most of the time on my exercise ball bouncing, I totally zoned out and remember very little to be honest. Chris tells me I shouted etc. but I don't remember the pain in any detail, the impatience I do remember! Anyway, after a straightforward no pain relief birth the first time round a homebirth second time round was a no brainer. Our hospital have a team of midwives specifically for homebirths, you have two midwives allocated for antenatal appointments and a least one of these midwives will attend the birth. They come to the house for all appointments (first time I had to go to my Drs surgery which ran notoriously late, one appointment was over an hour late) The midwife I knew the best was the one who attended the birth. She had been an independent midwife so was brilliant, totally didn't mind me questioning normal NHS policy. Chris and I decided against the vitamin K, we used embroidery thread for the cord tie, and had a natural 3rd stage same as the first birth.

Not having to go into hospital was awesome. It was fabulous not having to worry about when was the best time to go in. First time round I went in too early and got sent home then spent the whole day wondering when to go in. Once things kicked off second time round it was pretty intense and it was so reassuring to be in my own home. We borrowed an inflatable birth pool from a friend, I made sure Chris got it up and filled it early on, I'd heard too many stories of women not being able to use the pool with second births as they didn't get it up in time! I got in the pool once my waters went and was in there for 1hr 27 mins before she was born. Once she arrived I wasn't that comfortable in the pool so once it stopped pulsing Chris cut it and we all got out. It was so wonderful to be able to lie with her on my own sofa, skin to skin while she had a proper feed and fell asleep. The midwives stayed 2 hours and then left after helping Chris tidy up, then we just sat around for a while until Chris eventually went to get Aidan. The midwives came round about 4-5 times in the two weeks after birth and then signed us off. It was fantastic, I'd highly recommend a homebirth if you have supportive midwives, Chris agrees, he was very impressed with the whole thing, he felt more in charge of stuff he could be involved with, even just being able to put the kettle on to make a cup of tea for the midwives.

God that's turned into an essay. Maybe we should have started a separate birth thread. Oh well!

Thanks, that's exactly what T and I want, avoiding the hospital has been one of our main concerns. Except we're having it at a birthing center. In the part of Texas we live, there are only two midwives for at least a three hundred mile radius. They might work with a OBGYN, yet hospitals and doctors seem almost hostile to the idea midwives and outside hospital births. We have had a hard time with friends and family thinking we are crazy hippies for choosing this and that's hasn't been easy. The midwife we choose has been a blessing. She asks questions the doctors never did, has informed us of issues that doctors didn't and all in all has been more in sync with our vision of birth.

thanks all. yeah, the translation is "Lonely. Wish I could have a better family! Katie :)" given that we're talking about a kindergartener, it scores for me on pathos, lols, and drama scales. the mystery is in the %s.

my sister's immediate response was "that's exactly how i felt growning up in our house!"

Oh bless!

JS, out of the mothers at the baby group I went to with Aidan I was the only one who gave birth in the birth centre and I was the only one who had no intervention whatsoever. The others varied from induction, forceps/ventouse, through to C-section. Yes there are women alive now who would have died in childbirth without modern medical intervention but that's only a tiny minority, and a birth centre/homebirth doesn't mean you can't get that support if you need it. When things go wrong at birth it's either over a long period of time and a well trained midwife will know about it and seek help, or it's so quick that not even being in a hospital would make a difference.

Sounds like you've got a fabulous midwife!

I thought you might have meant "snacking"!

We had a homebirth the second time around and it was like night and day. For #1 we were in the hospital, hooked up to machines, eventually she went with an epidural, couldn't feel a goddamn thing, ventouse action eventually produced a result. Total exhaustion and never really feeling like we knew WTH was happening or what we should do.

For #2 we did a homebirth and, uh, I will admit that we dabbled in "hypnobirthing".. which is frankly an oversell of what it is. There are things the partner reads to the mother-to-be, touchy feely stuff with a lot of repetition, intended really to just help her get relaxed. A lot of light massage. She was a little apprehensive about the whole birth, given the suboptimal experience the first time around, and it really helped. In the event it all went really well. We had a pool but she gave birth before I could even get it filled up. After about four hours of contractions things suddenly got a lot more intense and she was like "I think we should go to the hospital" and the midwives were like, you're doing great, you don't need to go, and afterwards they told me that was the sign that they knew she was ready to start pushing. Less than 10 minutes later she'd given birth!

my 5-yo niece surprised my sister last week by asking if she'd ever been married before. (Yes.) Haven't gotten a report on the answer.

pardon the pop-in.

The information on the Vitamin K shot it a little baffling!

We figured, no one knows what a newborn's level should be, it's mother nature's 'yeah some babies may die after a traumatic birth but most will be fine' Vs modern medcines 'a tiny % of newborns would die without so we're going to inject this without actually knowing if it has any ill effect as it's impossible to tell' Birth was straight forward so we figured 'mother nature' was probably the right choice for us. http://aims.org.uk/Journal/Vol13No2/vitk.htm I'd decided against the injection definitely but was unsure about whether to give it orally or not.

Basically we were like "whatever u midwives say is our gospel" on that subject and every other

One cool thing about the homebirth was that the head midwife asked me if I wanted to check out the placenta! I was like... uh YEAH?! It's not like there will be many more chances. It was in a bucket. We took it up to the kitchen, spread it out on a plastic bag, and she showed me all the parts of it and explained what they do. Which I've remembered every detail of, obviously.

Wow! I would like to plant a tree the day after Baby August is born and place the placenta under the roots of the tree.

Wish I knew what happened to daughter no.1 placenta - the midwife said it was the biggest she'd ever seen. We had a home birth then and it was great - in our dining room, in an inflatable pool, v chill midwife tag team, all very cool. But post-birth we were sent to hospital for stitches - this was 1am or so. Were left in a waiting room for 4 or 5 hours, waiting for a free surgeon as there was some emergency rush on. Around 6am, sleepless, I had to go home and deal with the birthing pool before mother-in-law arrived. The term "blood bath" suddenly felt horribly literal. :/

D:

Even just dealing with cleaning up the non-birthed-in pool was a massive thing. I sort of wonder how worth it they are. Though people do say they're great.

I have been very impressed with our mid-wife. So far I have no fears and really don't expect to, but I did have a thought pop up that could have been a psychological block. I read that such things could impede labor so I brought it up with her and she pretty much counseled us (me) successfully. I appreciate the homework. She does work but we have work to do as well, it is our birth after all.

J. and I were talking about the spiritual air we encounter and just overall good feelings at her center but sans any new age vibe.

Planning on a water birth.

I read Birthing from Within and in the book they explained the different ways the placenta is used. I skipped over that part but went back and read it and thought that I might want to bury it with a tree. It isn't what I thought I would want to do because it all seems so "earthy" and I was the most non-earthy person there was but pregnancy has changed all that. So yeah, I want a placenta fruit tree now.

Placenta fruit tree is nothin' compared to what this lady did with hers:

http://www.momlogic.com/2009/04/i_ate_the_placenta.php

One of my good friends was vehemently against the medicalization of birth and had planned a home water birth (in the UK which is, as Vicky pointed out diff to the US in terms of attitudes about these things). Unfortunately she wound up being in labor for 5 days and having an emergency c-section. She was pretty devastated that things hadn't gone according to her plan in a way that makes me think it's pretty important to always bear in mind that anything can happen/change during the process. She recently had her second baby which was planned for a birth center delivery but it all happened so quickly that she had her in her bedroom before the paramedics even got to the house!

Tera - have you seen http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0995061/plotsummary? I thought it was pretty great.

Oh I meant to write out the title too. It's "The Business of Being Born".